Will Ramelius have competition for Spartan?

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Righto money miners.
The deal that's been talked

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about for bloody ever since
money of mine was called Money

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of mine.
Spartan and Remilius.

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It's finally happening, most
likely announced today.

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And mate, with any bloody M&A
and expansions that they're

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talking about, that means
Quattro Project engineering,

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that freaking Dalgar Anger pace
plant has got Quattro written

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all over it.
Like who else builds a pace

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plant?
I don't know, but there's one

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going in at Dalgar Anger I
reckon, and Quattro are the team

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to do it.
And any other EPC shit that

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Remelius need to do as part of
this Go Quattro.

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Is it a mega merger?
It's a mega merger.

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Let's just.
A mega merger in the Murchison.

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A mega merchison.
I like what you do.

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I like it.
What's the Murchison ratio on

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the deal?
100% Murchison.

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Oh, go Jeremy Palmer and go
Quattro.

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Oh love, it's right bloody
you'll drop me, mate.

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Hold.
On if we haven't.

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If we haven't given it away just
yet.

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I think we're only talking about
one thing today.

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I mean, we'll weave this one
into a broader gold chat.

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Yeah, at the end.
But this one is all about

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Remelius and Spartan.
And I reckon we've waited years

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for this, Maddie.
We were chatting about it

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earlier, I reckon as a plural on
that year.

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Well, I.
Reckon I reckon we could have

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ripped AI through everything
we've said for the last two

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years and just created an
episode based on what's been

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said and what should be said.
So anyway, we're gonna do it

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manual 'cause we're freaking old
school.

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I love that.
Good to have you back on the

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show, JC.
It's been a while.

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Nothing like a gold deal to
bring me back to the table.

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Actually.
Nothing like a Ding Ding Ding to

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get us started from JC as well.
I.

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I'm Remilia cannot believe that
there is a deal between two

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goldies and you only hold one of
them just.

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The one yes, and we've got JD is
a Ding Ding on on Spartan.

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So yes, it sounds like it's
finally.

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Happened so just delivering the
good balanced outlook and not

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holding either.
So good on you, Maddie.

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Oh I remember I bought Spartan
at 22, sold at 40.

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Profit's a profit.
Jesus Christ.

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Anyway, let's bloody RIP in the
transformational combinations

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I'd actually got.
There was the murmurs about it

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in Straight Talk on Friday that
this was they were inking out

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the deal.
I think it was Friday.

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It might have.
Been yesterday.

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It was the talk at Rottnest
apparently, that this was this.

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Yeah, this was buddy getting
close and well, and to be

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honest, even like like the start
of last week before I changed my

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mind.
Like I honestly didn't think it

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well, I thought it was just
gonna be too big of a swing for

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a Remelius to do and they would
have looked at other things.

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But yeah, look at it become I
think as you've written JD

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become abundantly clear that I
guess cleansing the market on

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that mount magnet long term plan
was integral to this deal

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happening.
And Remilius obviously pulled

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share price, pulled off a shit
load and without the 340 mil

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cash that's Remelius are tipping
in for this deal, it'd be pretty

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bloody close to a equal merger.
It would have been Remelius

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would have had low 50s, but it's
end up they got a still have got

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a bit over 60%.
So JD, why don't you, being the

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financial guru, take us through
the deal and the key numbers

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here, mate?
Well, we've got, we've got Ali

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on the show.
So we're, we're blessed on the

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on the finance part with, with
much more expertise than myself,

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but I'll run through the, the
headline numbers just to get us

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started in case people didn't
see the, the deal.

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So you talked about there,
Maddie, being that, that cash

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kicker, that's $0.25 for every
share that you hold as a Spartan

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shareholder.
And you're also getting .6957

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Remelius shares.
So at the at the 220 close price

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that we saw on Friday, we're
talking about an 11 percent

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premium to the last close on the
Spartan price or $1.78.

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It's trading like a bit a bit
below that.

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And if you zoom out and look at
the last month, it's about a 27%

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premium.
And like you say, Maddie

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massively altered by last week
of trading.

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So we'll, we'll flash up on the
screen now the last five days of

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each of the respective stocks
and how they looked.

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So over the week Remelius came
off 18% and obviously they had

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that big material bit of news
with the updated mine plan at

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Matt Magnet coming out.
And then if you look at Spartan

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they they ran hard at a a bit of
a down day earlier in the week,

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but then ended up 7% for the
week closing at $1.60.

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So very interesting to to piece
that all together and you know,

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think about all the other bits
and pieces that go to a deal

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coming together.
Obviously you spoke about that,

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that article coming out over the
weekend that gave a bit of an

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inside lane and gave the heads
up to everyone that it was, it

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was finally happening.
But yeah, there's, there's a lot

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to chew on there and we'll,
we'll get into that more in, in

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the details in a moment.
I'll just round off on a couple

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other details.
You've got the top three

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shareholders other than Remelius
in Spartan saying they're going

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to vote in favor of the deal,
but a superior offer coming in

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so that they speak for about 19%
of Spartans register.

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You've got Tembo who were there
back when the the recap happened

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that you touched on Maddie 1832
who came in throughout 2023 and

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then Fourth Sale who've also
been there for quite some time.

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It's a scheme of arrangement to
start with and we'll get into

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the deal structure as well.
And the pro forma is creating a

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business that is capped at 4.2
billion.

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So had this deal happened a
couple years ago, Maddie, we

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wouldn't be talking about a
number anywhere near that big.

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And you've still got 500 bucks
in cash post the payout that you

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mentioned, the $0.25 kicker per
share.

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So the last bit of detail, which
I think is pretty cool is that

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Ramili said they would cancel
their 19.9% shareholding in

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Spartan.
So the alternative would have

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been for them to sort of hold
them on, on treasury and kind of

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spin them out in a kind of quasi
capital raise, which we have

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seen in in deals gone by.
But they said they won't do that

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given the strength of the
balance sheet.

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So.
Yeah.

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And I think I think the best,
best way to get your head around

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that, which I had to get my head
around it earlier, like it's

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they've effectively bought 20%
of Spartan at, you know, lower

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prices.
Spartan shares are going to end

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up being Remelia shares.
So it's like a like a buyback.

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They've, they've essentially
bought the shares a while back.

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The shares are cancelled and
they're bought back and

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cancelled them is the way.
Even even if you.

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They haven't lost the money, it
just means that their this

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takeover offer is effectively
for 80% and they've bought back

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20% in a.
While for the money miners that

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listen to the episode on on Soul
Gold last week, you remember

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they did the deal with
Cornerstone and for three years

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they just held those shares that
Cornerstone owed in them.

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Soul Gold just on treasury.
They ended up selling them out

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to to Jiang Chi Copper last week
and that netted the company 18

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odd 1,000,000 bucks.
And yeah, no new shares being

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issued, but shares that the
company held in themselves.

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Yeah, that and I suppose they
could have like, are you saying

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like effectively Remelius could
have held on to the shares in

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treasury, then if the share
price ripped up, they could have

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block traded them to someone
else and it would sort of be a

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profit.
Could you read it that way?

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Yeah, it'd be, it'd be in effect
a, a raising of money for, for

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the company, kind of like, you
know, Red 5 and and Silverlake

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was the other one we saw this in
that was sort of alluded to in

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the in the call earlier.
And there's no new shares being

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issued, but the company is
netting, you know, 20%.

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They're netting potentially
hundreds of millions of dollars

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if they were to sell them.
But you nailed it.

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It's like it's like a buy back
in a way and just just cancel

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them, lower the the shares
outstanding.

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Given you've got the balance
sheet strength and you can fund

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all your other things still with
what you've got and the free

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cash flow that's going to come
over this half year and into

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next year, then why not?
Is that is that 500 million the

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pro forma based on today's?
Now 31 December Cash.

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Cash and bullion, they're
probably going to make frigging

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200 mil this quarter.
Like based on like.

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Zetna said 250 free cash this
half.

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Yeah, I was, I was surprised.
I thought that was Anders

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because based on the gold price
and what they made last quarter,

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it's like in the yeah, I'll I'll
be interested to see.

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I think it I wouldn't be
surprised if they make more just

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because they printing a lot of
freaking cash.

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And this is all in the all
happening in the context of, you

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know, a, a gold price that you
know, just touched over US 3000

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an ounce as well over the last
few days too.

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Yeah, Yeah.
I think 4650 at the moment

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today, yes.
But I think I did say that in a

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in a LinkedIn post from from
someone.

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A a pending Remelius employee.
We'll, we'll go.

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It's all right.
Speaking.

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Speaking of that, get in, get
into the board, Maddie.

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Oh, so it is.
We'll have a look.

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Here it is.
Two people coming over from

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Spartan Deanna Carpenter coming
on as Ned and Simon Lawson, non

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executive deputy Chairman.
So and there because there

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already is a non executive
chairman Bob Vassey and Zeppe's

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going to retain the MD and CEO
role.

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But I, I think it's probably
also a function.

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It said in the in the scheme doc
that Mister Lawson's shares that

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he gets in Remelius following
this if it all goes through, 50%

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of them will be escrowed.
It didn't detail how long they

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will be escrowed for that.
That's going to come out in the

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transaction booklet.
So you could predicted he would

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remain at a minimum on the board
while those shares are escrowed

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and then if he chooses to do
something else later on.

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But he is obviously going to be
a part of this next phase.

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If he's getting a shit lighter
Amelia's shares, he probably

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it's in his best interest to get
the best out of Remelia.

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And you know that talks about
lifting the exploration budget.

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He said in the call that he
wants to really look into the

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exploration potential of Mount
Magnet around there and was also

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pushed back on one of the
comments about Penny finishing

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early, like essentially saying,
look probably thinks there's a

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bit more potential there.
So he's already bringing his

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bloody optimism into Remelius,
it's called.

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Love to see it.
It's.

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Good to see so.
But at this stage, yeah, he's

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coming in to be a part of
Remelius, so.

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Yeah.
I mean non, non exec, you can

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kind of read into that as as you
sort of like.

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00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:03,320
But yeah, he did.
He did sort of speak to the the

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expiration angle which was which
was interesting.

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Right, Jodie, take us into the
mechanism of this two stage

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deal.
You'd say what do we call these

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deals?
It's just.

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The dual dual transaction
structure is is the words I

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wrote down that came to mind.
I'm sure there's a more

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aesthetic kind of way of putting
it, but.

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The the the the fuck off the
interloper deal.

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Steel structure, because I've
sort of seen this before, JD,

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haven't we?
In a totally different commodity

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admittedly as well, but seems to
be a bit of a yeah, like Maddie

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said, a bit of a a new style
sort of approach to the

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structure to sort of minimise
interloper risk.

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00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:50,520
These yeah, 100.
Percent.

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00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:55,640
The Azure structure inspired by
by Gina Rinehart.

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So yeah, SQM and Azure was the
first time we saw it when

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Maddie, you've fantastically
called it at 3 bucks 52 to the

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cent.
Yeah, you nailed it.

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They, they came in with that.
They came in that structure

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where they they'd pay in the
scheme 3 bucks 52.

223
00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:16,360
And if that fell through, they'd
have a backup 3 bucks 50

224
00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:20,800
takeover, which in their
instance was an on market

225
00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:22,640
takeover.
So very similar here, except

226
00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:26,160
that the backup is off market.
In that scenario.

227
00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:28,560
I think it's interesting to to
think about what happened

228
00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:33,120
afterwards.
So you had Gina start buying a

229
00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:35,040
heap of shares on market like
straight away.

230
00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,720
She got to 15% really quickly.
In a matter of no time, she was

231
00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:43,280
up to 18 kind of percent.
And then over two months, they

232
00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:44,880
were clearly working in the
background.

233
00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:50,000
She teamed up with SQM.
They came in in 5050 and

234
00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:53,200
launched another bid at 3 bucks
70.

235
00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:56,760
So there was there was a few
signals and that people might

236
00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:01,000
remember came off the back of
Gina coming into the Lion Town

237
00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:02,400
deal.
So that was the context that had

238
00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:06,080
happened before and that kind of
butchered Albemarle's takeover

239
00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,280
of of Lion Town.
So SQM didn't want that

240
00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,720
happening to their deal.
They did what they could, but it

241
00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:14,920
was a, it was a tough one.
If you guys remember, there was

242
00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,200
a lot of shareholders in that
sort of 10 to 20% range that had

243
00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:21,120
a bit of a say in, in how things
proceeded.

244
00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:25,960
So there was a few signals from,
from SQM in, in doing that.

245
00:13:26,560 --> 00:13:29,320
Firstly, they, they anticipated
interlopers.

246
00:13:29,840 --> 00:13:32,480
Secondly, that they had a, a
willingness or maybe a

247
00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:36,520
realization that they would have
to work with partners, whether

248
00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,600
that be in the the ultimate 5050
structure.

249
00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:41,760
I'm not sure what exactly they
were thinking that would look

250
00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,880
like in due course, but I think
they were, they were kind of

251
00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:47,640
happy with with the outcome and
they, they had a lot of strength

252
00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:50,880
because they had almost 20%
shareholding before and they had

253
00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,080
something like 25% off take
rights and and a few other bits

254
00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:56,640
and pieces.
So they were they were sort of

255
00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,360
talking from a position of
power, as is the case with

256
00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:03,080
Remelius here, right, 19.9%
shareholders coming into it.

257
00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:06,560
So, yeah, you've, you've got
those kind of dual, dual

258
00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:09,920
transaction structure for, for a
reason.

259
00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,400
And that's with the idea that an
interloper is probably

260
00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:15,800
interested in coming in and you
just want to get as much and

261
00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:19,160
you're happy to get as much,
even if that might not be 100%

262
00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:24,680
of the of the company.
So yeah, I mean, in this

263
00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:27,960
instance, if this sort of goes
through and I think the the

264
00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,000
outcome that Remilius want is
that the, the scheme just goes

265
00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:33,240
through without a hitch.
They get the votes they need,

266
00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,400
they wrap it up cleanly, they
have 100% of the company and

267
00:14:36,400 --> 00:14:41,160
then they become the big fish in
that Murchison kind of pond with

268
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:44,960
a another sort of long away to
deal potentially push down the

269
00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:47,880
the road a little bit.
And I think the, the trigger for

270
00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:53,880
this JD appears to be if, if
anyone, if a third party comes

271
00:14:53,880 --> 00:15:00,920
in and gains 15% or over of
Spartan, that's the the main

272
00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:04,800
trigger which flicks it from
this scheme of arrangement to an

273
00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:08,760
off market takeover.
So a. 100% you got the, the rest

274
00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:10,880
are just like those, those
standard kind of conditions.

275
00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:14,240
But if that 1 happens and
someone takes up or a a company

276
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,760
takes over 15% it, it flips over
to the other one, right?

277
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:21,240
Yeah.
And so it, it means Spartans

278
00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:24,120
like, it's not saying that they
can't be there won't be

279
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:28,240
interlopers like, but it there
could be, but they will have to

280
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:31,960
pay up for it.
So I guess Spartan have still

281
00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:35,240
got the upside to potentially
have someone come in over the

282
00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:39,360
top with this mechanism.
And if that happened, that off

283
00:15:39,360 --> 00:15:43,920
market takeover would sit there.
But if there's a much superior

284
00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:48,000
proposal, people will won't
accept the OP market takeover.

285
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,920
So there there's still upside if
there is someone come in.

286
00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,520
I just don't yeah, it doesn't
look like there is guarantee.

287
00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:59,000
I might see how myself look
stupid if I they if someone does

288
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:05,600
come in look like a real Dick.
Yeah but $2.4 billion implied

289
00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:08,200
price for Spartan.
That's a pretty big swing for

290
00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:12,880
someone to come in and offer 2.7
or three to get it over the

291
00:16:12,880 --> 00:16:13,800
line.
So.

292
00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:19,280
Yeah, so I, I mean, West Gold is
the the one that people will

293
00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:21,160
have on their mind.
They're the only one really in

294
00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,640
in the area that could also get
some sort of potential

295
00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:27,560
synergies.
Before we kind of expand on

296
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:30,600
that, it's worth just mentioning
that you've got the standard no

297
00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,800
shop, no torque, no DD
obligations on, on Spartan,

298
00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:38,280
which makes it a bit harder for
a potential interloper.

299
00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:40,600
They're they're doing that kind
of blind in a way.

300
00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,400
You've got the break fee which.
Was 24,000,000 bucks.

301
00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:46,360
They can't do DD effectively.
Yeah, no, they've got to put an

302
00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:50,080
offer in without DD.
Yeah, effectively that's how

303
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,240
that's how it's sort of read
you've got a you've got a break

304
00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,600
fee as well Maddie, which is
relatively low.

305
00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:59,560
So standard is anywhere kind of
between 1 and 4% of the, the,

306
00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:03,240
the value of the, the deal, the
market caps of the companies.

307
00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:07,920
And here we're talking like near
that 1% kind of range, $24

308
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:09,480
million.
Yeah.

309
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:14,400
Which I think was from memory
was like Corolla or West Gold.

310
00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,160
And that that was like, was that
like 40 million or?

311
00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:21,599
That that, that was 40 and each
and each company was half the

312
00:17:21,599 --> 00:17:24,640
size pretty much.
So that was 4% of their

313
00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:28,160
respective market caps going
into that deal.

314
00:17:28,359 --> 00:17:31,720
Yeah, so and like what, what's
the time frame like it

315
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:35,200
hypothetically, if it did flick
to an off market takeover,

316
00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,960
what's the like this?
This scheme looks to be

317
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:43,360
implemented mid-july.
What would an what could an off

318
00:17:43,360 --> 00:17:47,200
market takeover possibly take?
What fucking ages?

319
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:52,120
Well, it's yeah, it, it, it
often gets, it's extended in, in

320
00:17:52,120 --> 00:17:55,840
reality, in the, the docs you
can see they've written open, I

321
00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:59,200
think 2020 days is the what they
kind of peg it at.

322
00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,960
But you often see that get get
pushed as they want to, they

323
00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:03,600
want to get those numbers up
right.

324
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,360
And they want to, you know,
they're not say somebody comes

325
00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:08,280
in, they're not going to get to
compulsory because you need 90

326
00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:09,720
plus.
That's that's a real piece of

327
00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,880
work.
But you can push that up by

328
00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:16,960
extending it, extending it and
encouraging people to, to, to

329
00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:19,000
take you up on that, right?
Yeah.

330
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,400
So anyway, it's looking like
it's Yeah, they have to be.

331
00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,920
Something pretty crazy happened
for an interloper to come in and

332
00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,240
offer stupid money.
But hey, gold prices are at

333
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:29,960
stupid levels.
You'd never know.

334
00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:32,320
Yeah, jeez.
It about things interesting.

335
00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,920
And it about my our lives
interesting to talk about it.

336
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:40,200
Say, look, if you want to throw
in an offer, I'd appreciate it.

337
00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:42,920
I'm not.
Just just looking at the looking

338
00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:44,920
at the share price, you know
when the the market gets pretty

339
00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:47,640
excited about someone coming in
over the top as well.

340
00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:50,000
Yeah, it often trades above the
the beard.

341
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,800
We haven't really seen that he
sort of Ramili's share price

342
00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:57,880
came off a few cents and where
Spartan sort of therefore

343
00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,440
trading is almost bang on, just
a touch below par.

344
00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:01,800
About par, isn't it?
Yeah.

345
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,920
Yeah, 'cause I think Ramilius is
implied for them at based on

346
00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:09,920
them at 2:20 and now at 2:17 and
Spartan is trading at dollar 74.

347
00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:12,800
So it's yeah, she's pretty bang
on at the moment.

348
00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:16,560
Yeah, and and like in in that
deal I spoke about with with

349
00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:18,600
Gina, she started buying
straight straight away.

350
00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,720
We've only seen like 35 last
time I looked million shares

351
00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:23,440
traded near the end of trading
today.

352
00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:28,360
So that that's well below 3% of
the company's paper.

353
00:19:28,360 --> 00:19:31,760
You'd have to be going for a
fair while to to to make

354
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:35,400
something kind of happen bar the
the other three big shareholders

355
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:40,400
that I said holding about 19%
come to your your side if you do

356
00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:42,680
have a sort of superior proposal
for them.

357
00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:45,520
Yeah, got it's.
I suppose we don't know what's

358
00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,040
going to happen with never,
never yet.

359
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:50,160
It's early, early days.
It's not developed yet.

360
00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:55,280
They've just sort of getting
close to I think mid year

361
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:58,360
they're gonna be approaching
like in line with never Never.

362
00:19:58,360 --> 00:20:02,080
So there's a, there's a lot to
play out, but like how this has

363
00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:05,320
ended up so different to what
could have been considering last

364
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:10,040
year Westgold, well, Remilius
were having a swing at Korora.

365
00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:13,880
They were then also talking
about merging with Westgold.

366
00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:17,480
Not not that time merging with
Westcott would have discounted

367
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,000
this happening anyway.
But I would say if they ended up

368
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:25,920
with Corora and focusing on
getting beta hunt going like

369
00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:28,360
this wouldn't have I couldn't
have seen this happening as

370
00:20:28,360 --> 00:20:31,960
well.
So it's all panned out very

371
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:35,640
differently and on 1st pass.
This is probably the best thing

372
00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:39,920
outcome for Emilius getting this
asset in their portfolio.

373
00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:43,560
Whether, you know, whether there
was a bit of bit of like, oh,

374
00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,000
look over here.
So you start looking over here

375
00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,360
while I look over here.
And this was the grand plan in

376
00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:50,880
the end.
But yeah, it could have, could

377
00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:52,200
have ended up being a lot
different.

378
00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:55,800
Yeah, I mean, they've they've
had to give up a fair bit for

379
00:20:55,800 --> 00:20:57,000
it.
It's.

380
00:20:57,480 --> 00:21:00,840
Well, not as like, yeah, not not
as much as I think I'd in the

381
00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:05,760
end it was going to be 5545 can
or close to even a bit less.

382
00:21:06,360 --> 00:21:09,360
If it's going to be all the
shares, cash components sort of

383
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:12,520
swung a bit more in there and
Ramilius's favour as far as the

384
00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:15,000
pro forma ownership.
Yeah, and they'll, they'll make

385
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:16,720
that cash before the deals done
anyway.

386
00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:17,840
Oh.
They're right.

387
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:19,400
They're going, yeah.
Yeah.

388
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,520
So it's and it, but it
significantly lowered increase

389
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:25,600
their ownership of the the pro
forma.

390
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:30,160
So synergies we talk about
synergies this one actually and

391
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,560
we we will compare some what
this means for the value of

392
00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:37,760
other goldies in the region by
based on or in in Australia

393
00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,400
based on answers and projections
and all this.

394
00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:44,200
But you can you look at this and
you're like there is some

395
00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:49,520
genuine bloody synergies like
geographically infrastructure

396
00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:54,000
like it is just it does make a
lot of sense and like, hey, as

397
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:55,960
you said, JD, they're given a
bit away for it.

398
00:21:55,960 --> 00:22:00,880
But with that is coming the fill
in a big gap in that mount

399
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:06,920
magnet outlook that they
probably need and just delaying

400
00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:10,760
like not really having the
pressure to put any capital into

401
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:14,280
Dalgaranga processing plant
because they've got their own.

402
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,560
Yeah.
I mean this is probably correct

403
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:21,600
me if I'm wrong, but it's
probably the the first deal, a

404
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:26,640
gold deal in a little while in
in WA of this scale where we've

405
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:30,760
actually seen these sort of
geographical synergies.

406
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:35,640
The last one that springs to
mind was the Genesis with the

407
00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:39,240
Saint Brava sort of Gwalia
assets.

408
00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:44,640
But then even yeah, like you
said, Maddie, you know, I think

409
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:47,320
Sparta was originally mid.
You're going to put out a study

410
00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:49,640
on on Dalgrenko.
Never, never.

411
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:54,720
Now it looks like they're going
to do worked with Remelius on

412
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:59,280
like an integrated, you know,
mount magnet, you know, study

413
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,160
just because it just changes the
the landscape so much and what

414
00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:07,000
that actually looks like and the
and be interesting to see

415
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:11,080
quantified what those
geographical synergies could

416
00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:12,640
represent.
Yeah, yeah.

417
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:16,640
It's it's so essentially if you
were saying it's the first gold

418
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:20,880
deal that's made sense since we
started the show Genesis.

419
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:26,760
Not necessarily made sense.
I guess some geographical sense,

420
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,840
yeah, Yeah, geographical, yeah.
Because some have been more

421
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:31,360
acquiring.
I think we were talking about it

422
00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:35,160
early today, like some we've
seen have been acquiring more

423
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:36,320
new hubs.
Yeah.

424
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:40,120
And yeah, this is yeah.
As far as a, you know, in the

425
00:23:40,120 --> 00:23:43,400
same neighborhood, yeah, it's
been been a little while

426
00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:45,400
especially of of of this scale
too.

427
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:48,640
So, which is very, very cool.
Yeah, right.

428
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:50,760
Let's go.
I guess look at what this what

429
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:53,480
they're saying this pro forma is
going to look like.

430
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,800
Yeah, I mean, how cool is it to
see a deal with with genuine

431
00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:00,560
synergies?
It's it's awesome.

432
00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:05,280
And they haven't put numbers to
it to your point, Ali yet, but I

433
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,480
would bet these numbers would be
materially better than some of

434
00:24:08,480 --> 00:24:11,800
the other ludicrous kind of
synergistic numbers we saw on,

435
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,120
on other deals.
So very keen to see what that,

436
00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,880
that integrated study that you
you spoke to there looks like it

437
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,520
also takes the the pressure off
Rebecca Rowe.

438
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,600
So we spoke about it last week,
Maddie, with that big drop off

439
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,320
in production, the sort of
production gap that everyone

440
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:31,760
kind of speaks to with Remelius
coming after next year, it's

441
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,760
probably a bit too soon to fix
FY20 6 materially.

442
00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:41,480
But between then an FY30 there,
there was a bit of a lull in, in

443
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,960
the numbers on Remelius's front.
And this will, this will fill

444
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:46,760
the gap.
They're pretty handily.

445
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:48,920
And they're, I mean, they're
speaking by the end of the year

446
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,880
wanting to start sending Oz up
the road.

447
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,040
That sort of spoke to the
conditions of that road.

448
00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:57,840
It's sort of 65 odd kilometers
that I think in time they'll

449
00:24:57,840 --> 00:24:59,440
probably, they'll probably seal
up.

450
00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,800
He, he spoke to that Zetna on
the call.

451
00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,520
Right now it's just a gravel
road and they've actually

452
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,200
trucked on it in, in the past
going going beyond it.

453
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:11,240
So yeah, a bit to be done.
But that integrated study should

454
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,560
come out by December or that
final quarter of this calendar

455
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,560
year, which should be pretty
cool to see and to to see what

456
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,800
kind of scale they go with each
plant.

457
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,600
Like you said, they're Maddie.
They came up with this plan

458
00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:27,840
going 2 1/2 to 3 million tons at
Mount Magnet.

459
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:33,000
You've got 2 1/2 at, at
Dalgaranga, 70 million bucks had

460
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,960
been earmarked in the latest
Spartan Rays and I think a few

461
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:38,120
long lead items would have
already been ordered there.

462
00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:40,800
But they're going to pull the
foot right off that CapEx on

463
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:45,000
that front and reassess things
which is which is pretty

464
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:47,360
appropriate.
And in due course, by FY30, they

465
00:25:47,360 --> 00:25:52,120
want to be doing 500,000 oz,
which is, that's a, that's a

466
00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:54,960
pretty big year, you know, and
that kind of implies that we're

467
00:25:54,960 --> 00:26:00,680
getting beyond 200,000 oz from
from never, never slash pepper,

468
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,440
which is, which is chunky.
I mean, that year had only a bit

469
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:08,320
over 100,000 oz coming from the
mount magnet area.

470
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:10,480
So that's a, that's a lot of
upside.

471
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:14,240
And then obviously that the, the
piece being fitted in there as

472
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:18,000
well was Rebecca Row for 150.
So Maddie, what, what do you,

473
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,240
what do you kind of reckon?
I know you looked kind of deeply

474
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,560
at the actual production side of
things where they're going to

475
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:24,640
send oz.
You know what?

476
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,040
What do you think that that
looks like in the in the nearer

477
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:29,840
term?
Yeah, it was it was on your

478
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:34,120
comment about the 200,000.
You don't you don't get T Mac on

479
00:26:34,120 --> 00:26:37,600
the investigators too often.
But he he pretty much said, oh,

480
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:40,760
I just want to hear you say it.
You're effectively saying you're

481
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:44,720
going to get over 200,000 oz out
and never never and pepper

482
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:50,200
because it's it's exactly what
you what you said it's if

483
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:52,600
they're going to have 350 out of
the hub.

484
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:57,200
The only thing that's been added
in at the moment is down to

485
00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:01,080
Ranga into the study they put
out last week.

486
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:09,440
So like to get 200,000 oz, you
know, that's that's about that's

487
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,760
1.4 million tonne of 4 1/2
grams.

488
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:17,160
That's that's 200,000 oz.
So looking at and I'll get on to

489
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:18,680
where where they're going to
send it.

490
00:27:19,360 --> 00:27:22,000
How good was it straight away?
Sorry to interrupt scans, just

491
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,960
saying can can you pull that
forward or can you, can you kind

492
00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:29,200
of go overs on on the 500 the
first time they've mentioned it?

493
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:35,160
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
They're advising them how good.

494
00:27:36,120 --> 00:27:40,280
But yeah, that's it's all a
function of and I'll bring up

495
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:43,200
the the picture of the ore body
here.

496
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:45,000
Like and they said they're not
going to it's going to be about

497
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,480
two years before they get to
this the the the honeypot where

498
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,560
you got the increased strike
length of the top of top of

499
00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:54,200
pepper and never, never
together.

500
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,080
And that's going to be that's
when they will need to be in

501
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:00,920
that area.
And I would anticipate a lot of

502
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:06,960
other areas to really get to get
1.4 or around that sort of those

503
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,640
tonnages out of out of dagger
angle.

504
00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:12,120
Like, you know, they've got
they've got plenty of options,

505
00:28:12,120 --> 00:28:17,560
Like you got you got W West
winds, you've got potentially

506
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:19,080
the freak area.
You got.

507
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,280
What's the bloody one way?
I probably should actually sly

508
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:26,480
fox, sly fox and four pillars
and all that.

509
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,160
But that that stuff might come
out earlier.

510
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,400
Who knows?
But that's, that's sort of what

511
00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:33,800
they're what they're heading to
like because at the up the top

512
00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:36,640
there where it's only like the
first bit they get into that

513
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:38,280
they'll start tracking this
year.

514
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:41,640
That's probably only like it's
about 100 meter strike length.

515
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:45,240
So like rough mass, 100 meter
strike length, 15 meter wide

516
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,680
stops because it is a bit
thicker, the 25 meter level

517
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,400
spacing, that's only 100,000
tonne of ore per level.

518
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:55,080
So it's not like they're not
going to be getting heaps out of

519
00:28:55,080 --> 00:29:01,360
that initially.
So, but who knows by FY30 lot

520
00:29:01,360 --> 00:29:04,200
what the else they're going to
pick up in the region lot there.

521
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,960
There's so much frigging
drilling and stuff going on up

522
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:11,600
in the Murchison at the moment.
And I would imagine on an

523
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:17,560
expanded processing hub that'll
be who knows what's going to be

524
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:21,160
in the portfolio by them.
But they they've got ample

525
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,080
options and that and they've
clearly started in the call.

526
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:27,720
They've got to run a shit load
of scenarios to see what the

527
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:32,840
best paying for buck for the
shareholders are for the capital

528
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,320
spend.
So you could, your basic options

529
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:40,160
are expand the living shit out
of Mount Magnet Lion, like to go

530
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,880
from 3 to 4 million tonne, like
you got a it's a big step change

531
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,720
because you're probably going to
need it's not not the matter of

532
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:50,920
like probably needing bigger
piece of equipment.

533
00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:54,000
You might need multiple pieces
of equipment like you might need

534
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,880
multiple ball mills and and
things like that.

535
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,800
So is that like a bit of an
inflection point where you like

536
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,880
you hit a certain level and it's
not like linear, it's like, OK,

537
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:06,600
now you got to step up X amount
like it's not proportionate.

538
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:11,040
Yeah, you can buy ball mills so
big is my understanding.

539
00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:13,440
So you might need multiple
pieces of kit.

540
00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:17,200
So like they can either make
mount magnet as big as possible,

541
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,200
like expand that to say 4
million tonne.

542
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,720
They look and they've got you've
got the existing infrastructure

543
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:24,480
at Dagarango.
And when they talk about the two

544
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:26,440
and a half million tonne
capacity there, that's a

545
00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:31,080
function of the mostly the
crusher size and the big sag

546
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:34,400
mill they've got, but trading
harder all which they're going

547
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:38,040
to do though I would say they
would have to put in a ball mill

548
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,720
as well.
And like they were talking about

549
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,640
putting a thickener in and all
that, so.

550
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:47,680
Well, that's what I was going to
ask you actually.

551
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:53,440
I was just curious like, you
know, that that meal, the the

552
00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:57,840
purpose that meal was originally
established for, I guess, which

553
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,680
was, you know, all these sort of
open hits, right?

554
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:04,680
You know, now you know that
you've got this never, never.

555
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:09,480
And those sort of other areas
that are underground hard or I

556
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,840
guess it's, I was wondering like
that trade off between, you

557
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:20,560
know, optimizing an existing
mill that maybe for that new

558
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:26,200
type of ore versus trucking it
to somewhere else that's not too

559
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,240
far away, but expanding that
capacity.

560
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:33,720
I imagine that would all be part
of their scenario analysis for

561
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:34,600
that, right?
Yeah.

562
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:37,000
And then when that was first
built like it was there was

563
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,320
always the plan to put a ball
meal in later for when they it

564
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:43,400
was just initially designed to
trade all the open pit material.

565
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,320
Then once they got deeper and
went underground, they would

566
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:51,400
have added added to the plant to
treat the to grind the harder

567
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,960
all so it would have was always
in the plan.

568
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:56,120
It just, it just never got to
that point because.

569
00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:59,080
At that time, yeah.
Because of the unfortunate

570
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:03,560
downfall of gas coin, So
advantage of maybe potentially

571
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:08,240
not expanding mount magnet as
much and then also and refurbing

572
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:10,960
Dalgaranga.
It means it means you've got 2,

573
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:13,280
you've got 2 separate mills.
You don't have to truck the

574
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,520
Spartan dirt.
It means when you got to shut

575
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:19,200
down at mount magnet, you could
truck all your dirt to

576
00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:23,640
Dalgaranga and vice versa.
And like keep you got you're

577
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:26,200
always processing.
You don't have those down

578
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:30,360
periods, but then you need two
processing crews like you got

579
00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:35,960
extra, extra manpower to run 2
mills because I assume with like

580
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,440
all the the services that
support a meal like you don't to

581
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:43,120
go from say 2 million to 4
million tonne in a mill.

582
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:47,000
You don't need double the people
there because it's like a lot of

583
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:48,560
that.
It just means you got bigger

584
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:52,280
more capital outlay, but you
just got bigger equipment doing

585
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:55,360
a lot more work.
So there's, that's going to be

586
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,960
part of the scenario a lot the
trade off between extra capital

587
00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:02,920
at Mount Magnet and trucking the
ore at a lower processing cost

588
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:05,920
versus not tracking the Dagger
Angur ore.

589
00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:12,800
And because you know, 60 like 1
/ 1,000,000 tonne at 65 K is

590
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:14,800
like it, it freaking costs a lot
of money.

591
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,440
Like could be like 1520 cents at
TKM.

592
00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:21,200
So that's gonna be well.
And then like break a day.

593
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,880
I don't know if there's a road
going from break a day.

594
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,000
They could probably if it's
quicker to easier to get that to

595
00:33:26,000 --> 00:33:29,720
Dalgaranga instead of checkers
just sort of optimising.

596
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,400
Where to go?
I guess the other scenario to

597
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:35,320
throw in the mix there, and I'm
not sure how feasible this is,

598
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:43,160
is would you keep the existing
magnet infrastructure that

599
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:49,320
Remelius has and repurpose the
and you know, optimise it for a

600
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:54,520
combined production profile with
the Dalgarenga or and repurpose

601
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:58,240
the Dalgarenga meal for Rebecca,
right?

602
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:01,840
Could like, is it as easy to
actually move it?

603
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,560
Like, is that actually, am I
talking out of my arse or is

604
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,400
that a feasible thing to
actually do?

605
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:08,840
Yeah, yeah.
Well, they can I.

606
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:13,080
Know you can you can you can
move your your grinding

607
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:17,120
circuits, I think relatively not
easily, but like I think you can

608
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:20,520
like I don't know if the if they
could move the sag mill like I

609
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:22,280
think I don't know if you can
dismantle crush it.

610
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:24,560
I think I think leach tanks and
stuff are a bit hard 'cause

611
00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,000
they're like full on concrete
booted into the.

612
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,840
Ground like I.
Think it it can be done and like

613
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:32,719
moving it and unbolting and
things like they can get

614
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,920
deformed and stuff like I think
it all can be done but by the

615
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,639
time you truck it and everything
sometimes it like the cost of

616
00:34:40,639 --> 00:34:43,960
that and the dismantling like
it's the trade off of being.

617
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:45,600
Between.
Putting a new one in.

618
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,239
But there's there is
opportunity.

619
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,239
I'm sure there is some bits of
kit you can take.

620
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:54,040
But when you're building a whole
friggin mill, like there's still

621
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,719
gonna be the outlay.
So of course, yeah.

622
00:34:56,800 --> 00:35:00,400
So and as I said there, it's
knowing what future bits of dirt

623
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:04,640
are gonna go where go in, in the
future in the in the region.

624
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:09,800
Like they're not gonna really,
if there's some, you know, a few

625
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,560
100,000 tonne of oxide material
they can get a hold of in the

626
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:16,560
region, I'm sure they're going
to take it and they open

627
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,280
themselves up to all purchase
agreements and everything.

628
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:24,520
I think they, I think this deal
we'll talk about in a lot.

629
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:26,720
You mentioned W Guild.
Like I think now that they've

630
00:35:26,720 --> 00:35:29,960
got, if they're going to have
Dalgar anger in the portfolio

631
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:32,960
and the infrastructure there.
So it's really taken away a lot

632
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:36,920
of synergies with W Guild that
they would have been looking at

633
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:38,840
as part of a merger last year.
I don't.

634
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:44,760
I just like essentially Tucker
Bianna is not needed now if

635
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:47,760
they've got Dalgaranga there
that if they could spend a bit

636
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:49,560
of capital to create a hub
there.

637
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:54,640
So like Tucker, Bianna, Big
Bell, not really needed for them

638
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:56,000
now.
Like they they would get the

639
00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:59,840
Bluebird mill, put it like great
Fingal, then Starlights

640
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:04,040
Fortnum's on its own.
So yeah, I don't don't see them.

641
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,520
Yeah, I think West Gold are on
their own now.

642
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,800
And this is the whole Remelius
and West Gold thing won't ever

643
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,440
be a thing now.
Yeah, and on.

644
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:17,720
Moving the mill like there's a
lot of tons to to get through in

645
00:36:17,720 --> 00:36:22,600
in mount magnet sort of broader
area like Eridanus stage 3 alone

646
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:27,120
is 24,000,000 tons.
You've got another 11 at Q and

647
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:29,080
they're sort of broader other
magnet.

648
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,840
What they sort of grouped
together is 40 million plus

649
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,800
tons.
So I think there's a lot of use

650
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,680
from having the meal there and I
wouldn't anticipate that being

651
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,480
moved.
No, no, I think, I think it's.

652
00:36:39,720 --> 00:36:42,680
I think it's pretty clear cut.
It would either be unless I

653
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:45,400
picked up a fucking shit load of
ground in the region, it's

654
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:50,840
either going to be a 3,000,000
tonne or 2 1/2 to 3,000,000

655
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,680
tonne mill at Mount Magnet,
which was part of their original

656
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:58,600
expansion and reefer Dalgaranga
and sort of trade them both,

657
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:00,920
optimise them, yeah.
And like I said.

658
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,720
They can still get all the
tonnes from the mount magnet.

659
00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:10,360
The aerodynas cut back through
or just upsize mount magnet to 4

660
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:12,640
million tonne.
Do the instead of just

661
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:16,040
completely disregard Dalgaranga
and just send everything there.

662
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:19,400
So I think that's going to be
what the decision, what the

663
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:24,120
decision pending would be.
I don't see many other scenarios

664
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:30,880
or or or though or they won't
expand mount magnet at all and

665
00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,640
create a, you know, 1 1/2 mil or
one and a half million tonne mil

666
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:41,440
at Dalgaranga.
So yeah, three options I think.

667
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:46,520
So we will wait and see.
Bloody exciting, love it.

668
00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:52,000
What else is Oh, the
interesting, interesting

669
00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:55,920
underground mining thing that no
one else would care about unless

670
00:37:55,920 --> 00:38:00,440
you're an underground miner.
Is the the contract up there?

671
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:04,560
So bar Minkow currently at
Dalgaranga, they're doing the

672
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:07,640
juniper decline.
They just got extended for

673
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:13,200
another 1000 metres after like
the initial, I think it was

674
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:15,440
1200.
They got initially something

675
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:16,720
like that.
Anyway, they got given another

676
00:38:16,720 --> 00:38:21,240
thousand and that's scheduled to
finish about pretty much around

677
00:38:21,240 --> 00:38:25,760
the same time that this scheme
would be implemented mid-july.

678
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:29,560
So and you look at the actual
scheme docs, it says like

679
00:38:29,720 --> 00:38:33,600
Spartan's obligations with
Remelius during this period

680
00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:37,440
before it's implemented is that
they must consult Remelius in

681
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:40,840
regards to the contract award
processes for the underground

682
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:44,160
mining services for a contract
that exceeds 12 months.

683
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:51,120
So bar Minko went in extremely
cheap for this exploration

684
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:55,280
decline on the once you're
there, hopefully on the proviso

685
00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:59,120
you get the first look in and
you're already there for the the

686
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:01,720
ultimate production and
development contract.

687
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:05,640
But Burncard have the contract
with Remilius at Mount Magnet

688
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:10,120
and they just signed that
recently for another 3 1/2

689
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,880
years.
And part of that contract, I

690
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:17,080
don't think it's definite is the
potential break of day

691
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:19,640
underground.
So are there contractors

692
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:22,000
synergies?
So now that this deal's

693
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:27,320
happening, will Remilius look to
secure the same contractor for

694
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:31,040
all operations?
There's probably not like

695
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:35,560
considering it's what 65 K's
away I think from Mount Magnet.

696
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:39,960
It's not, it's, it's hard to,
you can sort of swap gear around

697
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:43,400
if you needed to in emergencies
or people and send them to

698
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:46,400
different operations.
But considering the size of it

699
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,280
in the separation distance, they
probably are standalone

700
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:51,120
contracts.
So there's probably not like if

701
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:54,720
there is contractor synergies
and you could say maybe have one

702
00:39:54,720 --> 00:39:58,360
project manager for two of it,
like or less management to cover

703
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:00,800
both.
Like Remelius would save money

704
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:02,360
that way.
But I think they'd probably

705
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:06,720
still be standalone contracts,
but you as a, you as a.

706
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,080
Yeah.
And you as a bigger company as

707
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:12,800
well, you know, naturally have
more sway over your, your

708
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,560
contractors and your suppliers,
whatever they might be

709
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:17,800
supplying, you know, when you're
a bigger entity.

710
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:19,400
Yeah.
So I think it just got a.

711
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,800
Bit more competitive for
Barminco anyway on the contract

712
00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:26,040
I definitely agree with you.
There, mate, Yeah, and that and

713
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:26,960
that'll be.
Probably.

714
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,840
I would assume that it'd have to
be and because I'll be wondering

715
00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:35,040
if they've signed, they're going
to be at the ore bringing out

716
00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:36,840
all by the end of the year out
and never, never.

717
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:40,080
That means that contract will
have to be sorted out soon

718
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,000
because they're not going to
leave a low period between when

719
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:47,480
Bar Minko's one finishes.
So right now that's the next big

720
00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,360
contract and the best thing
about when contract tenders are

721
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,680
going around, they're all like
Nah, Oh yeah, Bar Minko's got

722
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:55,280
it.
And then you're another like Nah

723
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:57,840
mate, oil burn cuts got it, Nah,
they've got it.

724
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:00,560
I reckon they've got it.
Oh I love it, love it, love it.

725
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,920
Great pub talk.
Oh mate, didn't think of the

726
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:06,120
bloody thing of the pub talk
about when they're seeing

727
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,800
frigging Sambic grand sport
trucks flying up the Murchison.

728
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:13,480
They're Sambic are making the
Murchison great again.

729
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:17,240
They're just going to be feeding
bolts into this underground

730
00:41:17,240 --> 00:41:22,080
might that they it's.
Oh, I've just, I I cannot wait

731
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:23,920
to see it.
Anyone sees the Sandvik ground

732
00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:26,000
sports truck driving up the
merch?

733
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:29,520
So I assume they've swapped the
DSI logo for Sandvik logos

734
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:30,800
probably by now.
Yeah, Yeah.

735
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,960
You'd think so.
Buddy, get a get a photo of us

736
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:36,880
there bloody that mount magnet
Mill's just gonna be there's

737
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:40,920
gonna be Sandvik split sets and
mesh and everything just flying

738
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:42,680
through that.
The magnets are gonna be picking

739
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:45,520
them all up after they've done
their job of making the ground

740
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:47,160
safe.
And if, mate, if you want to get

741
00:41:47,160 --> 00:41:51,160
rid of the friggin the mesh and
the friggin bolts before it goes

742
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:54,440
in there and just make the awe
nice and pretty, you know Mozzy

743
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:57,280
up there Mozzy's contract miles
contracting.

744
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,880
They they can remove your once
Sandvik have done their job.

745
00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:03,960
Mozzy can make it look pretty
for you as well.

746
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,720
The bloody, the the awe cleaner,
making the merchants and great

747
00:42:07,720 --> 00:42:08,960
again.
I love it.

748
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:14,000
Couple other notes, a couple of
other notes from the calls,

749
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:17,240
buddy, What did we get?
Oh, tax losses.

750
00:42:17,240 --> 00:42:21,000
Apparently they're now the
benefit to Remelius is a lot of

751
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:24,840
the tax losses that are
contained within Spartan that

752
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:27,480
were brought in by the gas coin
dice.

753
00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:31,200
So Remelius because they're
making money, heaps of money now

754
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:33,800
they're paying tax which would
which would piss them off.

755
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:37,880
So it sounds like a lot of the,
the infrastructure at Dalgaranga

756
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:42,480
can be used as depreciation for
Remelius.

757
00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:45,880
So that'll that'll come in.
So there's a bit of bit of

758
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,720
offsetting to do there.
So, Matty.

759
00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:50,560
What?
What?

760
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:52,840
I think you've gone.
On the you've mentioned that two

761
00:42:52,840 --> 00:42:54,840
coat seal.
They've got a Chuck on Chuck on

762
00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:57,400
that road.
Whatever bloody 2 coat 2 coat

763
00:42:57,400 --> 00:42:58,560
seal.
Does that mean it's bitchman?

764
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:00,600
Nah, must be just they can ask
me in raise.

765
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:04,880
Yeah, that's about it.
What?

766
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:06,920
What else?
JD mate, You, you, you.

767
00:43:06,920 --> 00:43:10,680
Did a bit of digging on how this
deal and the valuation of this

768
00:43:10,680 --> 00:43:14,200
deal reflects on the rest of the
the goldies.

769
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:17,280
So I think it's worth kind of
flicking through, you know, the

770
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,960
the more or less stand alone
groups, the Bellevue's of the

771
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:24,080
world kind of Pantoro catalysts
sort of come to mind.

772
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:27,040
A lot of them have had, you
know, Bellevue excluded pretty

773
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:30,400
good runs of late given given
the gold price movement.

774
00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:34,320
What did you sort of what did
you sort of come to in in that

775
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:35,600
analysis you did?
Yeah.

776
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:39,640
And like we're we're.
Thinking of, OK, this is we're

777
00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:43,920
inferring that OK, they're
pretty much saying Dalgarang is

778
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:49,680
going to add at least 200,000
ounces to FY30 and they've paid

779
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:52,280
2.4 billion implied price for
it.

780
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:53,680
So we're like right, what is
that?

781
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:55,320
What does that mean for everyone
else?

782
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,720
And that as I said, I'll caveat
that with that point, $2.4

783
00:43:58,720 --> 00:44:02,800
billion is backed by some
genuine geographical and

784
00:44:02,800 --> 00:44:06,880
infrastructure synergies.
So that's like whether what what

785
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,480
they're valued at, I don't know.
But and we're doing, we're doing

786
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:13,000
pretty.
Rough analysis not not just

787
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:16,760
focusing too much.
And they're.

788
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:18,880
And they're.
Bringing in they're bringing in

789
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:22,520
some exploration now as well.
Like I think the fact that

790
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,920
they're gonna really amp up the
exploration spend and bring in

791
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:31,400
that, you know, technical you
can say like God, you can't you

792
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:33,680
got a compliment Spartan in the
job they've done.

793
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:39,880
They've 17X that share price in
a couple of years, like less

794
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:43,680
than a couple of years done it.
And so that's getting a bit of

795
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:47,520
that expertise in Ramilius.
That's just adds to it as well.

796
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:49,520
So.
But look, it's been a hell of a

797
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:50,200
run.
Yeah.

798
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,560
And like, yeah.
I, I think it is making bloody

799
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:58,800
Bellevue look interesting at at
these prices cause like their,

800
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:03,440
their market cap is 1.7 bill.
So remember that we're, we're

801
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,360
valuing this Spartan that
they're valued at 2.4,

802
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,400
Bellevue's 1.7.
They've got 100 mil of debt, 80

803
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,600
mil cash and a head.
But the hedge book is 390 mil

804
00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:16,800
out of the money.
So that gives them an EV of 2.1

805
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:22,120
billion.
They're based on their, what

806
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:24,760
they're saying is what they're
predicting.

807
00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:30,120
They're two quarters away from
hitting the 200,000 oz run rate

808
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:32,760
is what they're what they're
predicting if they execute.

809
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:36,800
But the ground, ground is pretty
hard at Spartan from what I

810
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:38,160
hear.
Not it doesn't sound like it's

811
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:39,720
Bellevue hard.
So, but it is hard.

812
00:45:39,720 --> 00:45:42,960
It's not like cream digging and
they're gonna fly through it.

813
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:47,560
And look, I didn't anticipate
the capital and operating costs

814
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:50,680
for the underground development
at Spartan will be a lot lower

815
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:53,560
than Bellevue.
Just just as a function of the

816
00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:58,240
layout of the ore bodies and you
know, be a be a lot of jockeying

817
00:45:58,240 --> 00:46:01,160
of power vent and pumping and
everything like that.

818
00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:03,800
It's not as spread out.
So probably a bit back better

819
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:07,520
bang for buck per meter.
But look, the Bellevue are

820
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:12,600
already like this is 200,000
ounces is still years away at at

821
00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:16,480
this operation and 200,000
ounces of Talgaranga will be a

822
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,920
bit of a stretch in, in my
opinion.

823
00:46:19,240 --> 00:46:22,320
But you know Bellevue, well,
they're currently producing.

824
00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:23,680
It's all.
Yeah, they're they're.

825
00:46:23,680 --> 00:46:26,320
Nearly there right now and all
the infrastructure, the a lot of

826
00:46:26,320 --> 00:46:31,640
the capital's being sunk to get
there and they're cheaper than

827
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,480
cheaper than Spartan.
So like this quarter, I think

828
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:40,200
coming up, which like say next
month or they're they're they're

829
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:43,560
back quarter weighted.
I think they're saying Bellevue,

830
00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:45,920
but like they're so the next
quarter if they hit the low

831
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:50,360
30,000 oz, that's probably a
cash flow break even for them.

832
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:55,320
Maybe maybe a bit negative.
Hopefully, you know, like 4600

833
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:57,640
odd buck gold price is really
freaking helping them.

834
00:46:57,640 --> 00:46:59,840
They'd be, you know, a lot of
bloody hurt there, but they

835
00:46:59,840 --> 00:47:04,120
don't have to truck their dirt.
They're they're sort of

836
00:47:04,240 --> 00:47:07,920
approaching that inflection
point possibly if they execute.

837
00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:10,880
So yeah, that's when you put
them side by side.

838
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:14,480
It's like well is have they ever
paid for Spartan or is Bellevue

839
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:18,560
cheap at 2.1 billion?
I guess on the trucking side of.

840
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:20,960
Things that's assuming that it
get it.

841
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:26,520
They truck to this is Spartan or
Remilius, you know, decides to

842
00:47:26,520 --> 00:47:30,560
truck that Dale Garang off from
Dalgaringa to mount Magnet as

843
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:32,600
opposed to using the nearby
mill.

844
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:34,560
That's Yeah, but yeah, but you
still have to put.

845
00:47:34,560 --> 00:47:36,120
The capital, but yeah, yeah.
So it's.

846
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:39,000
Either the trucking or the sort
of the money you're putting into

847
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:42,800
the refurbishment of that and
and two years of.

848
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:46,800
All the capital underground
leadingment into that 200,000 oz

849
00:47:46,800 --> 00:47:49,840
which is a lot a lot of money.
So yeah, I think them side by

850
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:52,320
side is very interesting.
But they're these answers

851
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,840
they're getting out of Spartan.
They're unhedged like they're

852
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,320
they're not got full upside of
the gold to the gold price.

853
00:48:01,320 --> 00:48:04,120
Pantoro is another one.
Yep, everyone's going for

854
00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:05,680
200,000 oz.
It's easy.

855
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:08,040
It's good round Number, so it's
an easy one to compare.

856
00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:11,840
They're they're talking about
getting a 200,000 oz by Fr 28.

857
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:15,360
They're over.
Just they're they're over 1

858
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:19,120
billion market cap, bang on
around 1 billion again, probably

859
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:21,520
a lot higher costs than Dalgar
angle a lot, a lot of narrow

860
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:23,960
vine and and everything but
existing plant.

861
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:27,760
They're in the process of
replacing the open pit feed with

862
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:31,760
underground feed.
Got 120 mil cash only got that

863
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:36,080
US 12 and a half million con
note, but you know, EV of 900

864
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:38,680
mil.
So I think they're looking

865
00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:42,240
interesting side by side
catalysts, as you mentioned, JD,

866
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:48,480
but they've nearly 6X in a year,
but like still they're it's

867
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:50,520
probably a function of shares on
issue.

868
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:55,920
They're still what are they just
below a bill or they're no,

869
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,880
they've just cracked a bill
market cap debt free unhedged

870
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:02,720
FY20 7.
They're forecasting 200,000 oz.

871
00:49:02,720 --> 00:49:06,640
So all these 200,000 oz numbers
are coming well before Spartan

872
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:09,600
they're gonna release the
Dalgaranga's gonna release

873
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:15,720
potentially get 200,000 oz there
and their mill is underfilled.

874
00:49:15,720 --> 00:49:19,760
So for the 1.8 million tonne per
annum mill at Platonic, it's

875
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:21,680
only getting 1.2 through it at
the moment.

876
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:24,280
So they've just hit first door
at Platonic.

877
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:27,240
EI think they got that it's AK 2
or something they've just

878
00:49:27,240 --> 00:49:32,040
started developing yeah down
into that so and yeah again

879
00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:36,320
under half the half the implied
price of what they're paying for

880
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:39,320
Spartans the answers so yeah I
think when you put them side by

881
00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:43,560
side it's yeah you don't know
you don't have a pain or are

882
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:46,400
they the other ones cheap yeah I
think I'd add a.

883
00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:49,240
Couple of things, Matty.
Firstly, on the on the value

884
00:49:49,240 --> 00:49:52,920
that Remilius is paying for.
Spartan.

885
00:49:53,840 --> 00:49:55,720
Pretty much 20% of that, they
didn't.

886
00:49:56,120 --> 00:49:58,440
They're not paying.
They've paid for in the past,

887
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:01,600
but that was sort of at half the
share price of today in in a

888
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:03,440
way.
So you could say 2 point.

889
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:06,240
Two like effectively because
they're nearly.

890
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:07,360
I can't really know what
they're.

891
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:08,760
Exactly.
Paid, yeah.

892
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:13,240
And then you've also got the the
cost side of it, which is like

893
00:50:13,240 --> 00:50:15,320
the the big one we haven't
mentioned.

894
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:18,200
But just looking at those kind
of forecasts on for instance,

895
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:24,160
catalyst FY25 sort of 2400 bucks
an ounce all in sustaining cost

896
00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:29,400
FY20 6, 2200 and that kind of
maintains or they try to pull

897
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:32,560
that down over the years ahead.
So cash flows all that matters

898
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:34,480
at the end of the day.
And we'll kind of see what what

899
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:39,120
it comes out at for, for Spartan
hoping that that higher grade

900
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:42,400
obviously that that grade is
kind of comparable in a way with

901
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:45,800
with Bellevue.
And you would expect those two

902
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:49,720
because of that to have pretty
competitive costs.

903
00:50:49,720 --> 00:50:53,960
But yeah, we'll see them.
We'll see them get there first.

904
00:50:54,040 --> 00:50:55,240
What do you what do you think
about?

905
00:50:55,240 --> 00:50:59,640
The gold space in general, JD,
of Where are we approaching

906
00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:02,080
daily?
I'll get started on the genius

907
00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:05,480
later, but.
Where do you think we're?

908
00:51:05,640 --> 00:51:10,000
Sitting at the moment with, you
know, the valuations multiples

909
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:15,200
and has everything risen to
where it needs to rise to in

910
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:18,160
accordance with the gold price
or not mate, it's.

911
00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:21,680
It's a super, super interesting
part of the the commodities

912
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:24,760
market right now, right.
And yeah, let let's definitely

913
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:28,480
bring it down to the the juniors
in a second, because it's

914
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:31,680
interesting comparing juniors to
your mids to your, your sort of

915
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:34,880
mega cap goldies.
But I, I reckon the, the space

916
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:38,800
in my mind has been getting more
and more attention lately, but

917
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:42,040
I, I don't reckon the value, the
valuations are what they kind of

918
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:43,920
could be.
And I think everyone just throws

919
00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:47,880
around the, the old comparison
of the, the GDX, that's the, the

920
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:54,040
miners index versus the physical
metal since say 2010 roughly.

921
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:57,760
And GDX has been an
underperformer, especially since

922
00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:01,600
sort of 20/12/13 when things
fell away that, that cycle

923
00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:05,680
really unwound.
But even if you look back 5 odd

924
00:52:05,680 --> 00:52:09,920
years to the beginning of COVID,
we've seen pretty awesome margin

925
00:52:09,920 --> 00:52:12,240
expansion.
We're hopefully starting to see

926
00:52:12,240 --> 00:52:14,480
that and we have with some
companies start to see that come

927
00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:17,960
through, say Evolution last
quarter was an awesome cash

928
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:20,920
print and hopefully we see that
more and more across the board

929
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:24,840
as the gold price runs away and
costs, you know, they are up a

930
00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:26,280
good bit.
We had that really inflationary

931
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:28,480
kind of spell, but they're not
up to the same extent.

932
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:31,280
So those margins have had a real
step change to them.

933
00:52:31,720 --> 00:52:35,040
Balance sheets are improving
like the net debt positions

934
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:38,440
across the border are pretty
healthy and the ones that do

935
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:41,040
have substantial can can
hopefully pay that down.

936
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:44,880
M&A been pretty, pretty sensible
across the board in my mind.

937
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:48,680
Capital allocation has been
pretty good, but the, the

938
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:53,400
physical versus the miners has,
you know, it's just gone in One

939
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:57,640
Direction that that physical
metal has just outshone the the

940
00:52:57,640 --> 00:52:59,520
miners themselves.
And that's mainly to do with

941
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:03,560
central banks and what they've
done and everything that sort of

942
00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:07,080
came about following Russia's
invasion in Ukraine.

943
00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:10,600
But I reckon there's a serious
potential tailwind for these

944
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:12,360
miners.
And this will push all the

945
00:53:12,360 --> 00:53:15,160
companies we just mentioned in
the right direction.

946
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:18,080
If you start to see the
multiples kind of match what

947
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:21,080
they were a few years ago or
even, you know, God forbid,

948
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:25,720
expand on what they were a few
years ago to really compensate

949
00:53:25,720 --> 00:53:28,280
for the the added kind of Moat
and margin that they're now

950
00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:30,440
making.
And I think that's super

951
00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:31,960
interesting.
And we've we've started to see

952
00:53:32,240 --> 00:53:36,880
more funds wrap up these
dedicated gold funds or you

953
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:40,120
know, open gold funds, they may
have closed previously to new

954
00:53:40,120 --> 00:53:43,360
investment, those sorts of
things, which is an interesting

955
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:46,080
anecdote in my mind.
Yeah, just to add to.

956
00:53:46,080 --> 00:53:51,200
That I think even you've seen a
lot of the gold producers where

957
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:56,200
they've just you know finished
delivering into their hedge

958
00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:59,520
books or they're sort of working
through them and working down in

959
00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,640
them.
But then as their hedge books

960
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:05,760
are decreasing, they realise
gold price for you know say the

961
00:54:05,760 --> 00:54:10,560
next quarter is maybe a few
$100.00 an ounce more so then.

962
00:54:10,720 --> 00:54:13,520
You know that's.
Still it's sort of been washing

963
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:16,440
its way through, but it, I feel
like it's still continuing to do

964
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:20,160
so for, for some of those
producers that do have hedge

965
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:22,840
books in place or finishing them
off or just finish them.

966
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:26,080
So, you know, immediately, yeah,
next quarter you're already

967
00:54:26,560 --> 00:54:31,320
you're getting the the realised
price increasing from that, but

968
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:34,240
then also the gold prices
increased as well.

969
00:54:34,240 --> 00:54:38,240
On top of that.
There's that, that the whole,

970
00:54:38,240 --> 00:54:41,640
you know, PNEV thing, you know,
usually with, you know, in these

971
00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:44,720
real bull markets we've seen,
you know, the pay Navs for gold

972
00:54:44,720 --> 00:54:50,880
producers sort of above above
that one one times PNEV being

973
00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:53,480
priced to net asset value for
those who don't know.

974
00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:58,080
And you know, a lot of them are
still sort of sub one or barely

975
00:54:58,080 --> 00:54:59,920
breaching one just at the
minute.

976
00:55:00,720 --> 00:55:05,440
But yeah, that that comment
about not just necessarily gold

977
00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:09,440
funds starting to being, you
know, opened up or reopened and

978
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:12,400
things like that, but that whole
shift of, you know, if you're

979
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:16,120
taking away the the technical
fundamentals away from the

980
00:55:16,120 --> 00:55:22,240
story, just the fact that the
the, the flows from generalists

981
00:55:22,240 --> 00:55:27,800
into gold, just that that in its
own right, you know, could be a

982
00:55:27,800 --> 00:55:31,760
seismic shift in in this space.
Even if you Chuck all the

983
00:55:31,760 --> 00:55:35,040
fundamentals out the window,
that'll be without.

984
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:39,520
Doubt the biggest shift if it if
it does happen and yeah, on on

985
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:42,880
the P NAV multiples, you know,
you, you see a lot of these

986
00:55:43,040 --> 00:55:46,920
companies trading at sort of
point 7.8 times consensus and

987
00:55:47,160 --> 00:55:51,240
that's sort of flashing through
a gold price that that's sort of

988
00:55:51,240 --> 00:55:53,960
hundreds of bucks below where we
are.

989
00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:58,080
So you, you think about that in
the sense of a Spot gold price

990
00:55:58,080 --> 00:56:02,800
being being flushed through and
you, you can make the, the case

991
00:56:02,800 --> 00:56:05,240
for these a lot of these names
being, you know, the whole

992
00:56:05,240 --> 00:56:07,680
basket of names being pretty
bloody cheap.

993
00:56:07,680 --> 00:56:11,480
But yeah, there, there's a lot
of concerns that are at a macro

994
00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:13,880
level around the world right
now.

995
00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:16,440
And I think people tying in with
that understand the importance

996
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:19,320
of having a bit of gold in in
the portfolio, whatever they

997
00:56:19,320 --> 00:56:24,080
think of the the miners, you
know, But I think sooner or

998
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:27,040
later if if things persist,
people do start to look at the

999
00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:32,560
miners, I think I don't think.
We've yet seen the retail really

1000
00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:36,080
flow into small caps.
There's sort of been glimmers.

1001
00:56:36,080 --> 00:56:41,720
But it hasn't, it's not
reminiscent of a full, you know,

1002
00:56:41,760 --> 00:56:43,960
gold bull retail market just
yet.

1003
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:46,640
It doesn't feel Nah Nah like.
No, nobody.

1004
00:56:46,840 --> 00:56:47,760
Nobody.
Cares, do they?

1005
00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:49,560
Nah, but you look.
At what?

1006
00:56:49,600 --> 00:56:54,480
Like the lithium, Lithium retail
mania when we like a couple of

1007
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:57,320
years ago, like, yeah, I don't
we haven't really seen that for

1008
00:56:57,320 --> 00:56:59,720
gold yet.
And look, oh, I wouldn't be

1009
00:56:59,720 --> 00:57:03,480
surprised if that's that's on
the way the stair goods.

1010
00:57:03,640 --> 00:57:05,400
I'll be right there in that
time.

1011
00:57:05,400 --> 00:57:10,200
Oh, I think the.
The the outlook for for sort of

1012
00:57:10,200 --> 00:57:13,440
society and and what's going on
if the the gold price goes in

1013
00:57:13,440 --> 00:57:15,760
that direction.
It's quite concerning to think

1014
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:17,520
about that.
I think we've got yeah, bigger

1015
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:22,320
problems, but right, but it'd be
great for gold juniors, but but

1016
00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:24,000
even.
If it, if it's stayed at this

1017
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:30,200
level right now and sustained
here like that is still a shit

1018
00:57:30,200 --> 00:57:35,880
load of, you know, value for
bigger companies picking up

1019
00:57:36,120 --> 00:57:39,360
juniors to increase their Oz
profile 'cause you know, they're

1020
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:41,240
making such good margin on the
dirt.

1021
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:45,040
So I they, they, they will.
Struggle to find the good

1022
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:47,640
projects to put the the cash
into it, because if these gold

1023
00:57:47,640 --> 00:57:51,320
prices maintain and and they
keep costs down, they'll be

1024
00:57:51,320 --> 00:57:54,560
making such healthy money.
It'll be, it'll be a very

1025
00:57:54,560 --> 00:58:00,600
interesting sort of shift in in
how how the companies have to

1026
00:58:00,600 --> 00:58:03,000
act with with their sort of cash
balance and how they have to

1027
00:58:03,000 --> 00:58:05,080
allocate capital.
Yeah, I.

1028
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:06,720
Think you know things don't tend
to stay?

1029
00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:09,320
Still for for too long, so I
think.

1030
00:58:10,160 --> 00:58:14,440
Just things that are occurring
to me, you, you look at this

1031
00:58:14,440 --> 00:58:19,080
deal and geographical synergies
and the, the, the theory behind

1032
00:58:19,120 --> 00:58:22,840
it.
I think if West gold are out of

1033
00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:25,680
the race with these two now and
they're not really thinking

1034
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:29,720
right, what's our next play?
I think that talk of West Gold

1035
00:58:29,720 --> 00:58:33,240
Pantoro really, really might
start heating up.

1036
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:38,160
I think because it's, it's a bit
of a carbon copy of this on a on

1037
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:42,560
a different scale, because them
getting that, that noseman dirt

1038
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:45,960
to feed into an upsized
Higginsville mill actually sort

1039
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:50,160
of makes a lot of sense whether
they go down that road or not

1040
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:52,440
there.
Because W Carle's back up near 3

1041
00:58:52,440 --> 00:58:55,520
bucks now, like after it, it's
sort of had a RIP in the last

1042
00:58:55,520 --> 00:58:58,080
couple of weeks.
So 2.7 billion market.

1043
00:58:58,080 --> 00:59:00,960
Cap yeah, so when they're.
Whether their script starts,

1044
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:05,760
they'll consider using that to
maybe look at something.

1045
00:59:06,360 --> 00:59:11,320
Yeah, I think you'd want to.
Say at least a couple quarters

1046
00:59:11,320 --> 00:59:16,320
of demonstrated improvement on
those sort of matters that

1047
00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:19,400
they're addressing, you know,
sort of post that guidance cut

1048
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:22,480
just to give a little bit more
confidence in that script.

1049
00:59:22,600 --> 00:59:26,880
I would have thought, which it
seems like that's, you know,

1050
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:30,200
what they're working on and and
and, you know, working towards.

1051
00:59:30,200 --> 00:59:33,440
But I think you'd want to, you
know, see that fleshed out in

1052
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,520
some hard numbers and results in
the next little while or two.

1053
00:59:36,560 --> 00:59:37,960
Yeah, because they won't have
the ability.

1054
00:59:37,960 --> 00:59:41,160
To put the cash kicker in like
Remelius have had, you wouldn't

1055
00:59:41,160 --> 00:59:45,120
anticipate, but they do have the
facility they could they could

1056
00:59:45,120 --> 00:59:46,640
raise.
Money, you know, but you know,

1057
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:49,760
you'd you'd probably want to do
that out of your cash balance or

1058
00:59:49,760 --> 00:59:52,280
cash flow.
I'd imagine that's something

1059
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:56,440
that they decided to pursue.
So yeah, no, it's fascinating in

1060
00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:59,200
the mid goal in the.
Midst of in the midst of this

1061
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:01,160
deal, we're like, right, what's
the fucking next one?

1062
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:06,320
You could enjoy this one.
I think the great thing as well,

1063
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:09,760
which you know, we've sort of
heard anecdotally around the

1064
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:13,800
grounds, which I think, you
know, super positive is just

1065
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:18,840
sort of a bit of renewed
optimism for in these sort of

1066
01:00:19,440 --> 01:00:23,400
gold fields areas around, you
know, I would say WA in

1067
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:25,720
particular.
And the flow on that has to

1068
01:00:26,360 --> 01:00:30,240
contractors and businesses and
all that, that service the

1069
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:33,800
mining industry, which we all
know gold is, drives a lot of

1070
01:00:33,800 --> 01:00:37,760
that work.
So that's really great to see

1071
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:39,560
too.
Yeah, and now they're making

1072
01:00:39,560 --> 01:00:40,160
more.
Money.

1073
01:00:40,160 --> 01:00:43,920
If you want to make more money,
get us to sponsor us and we'll

1074
01:00:43,920 --> 01:00:46,280
tell everyone our goods are that
too.

1075
01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:48,400
Talk about.
Talk about the best use.

1076
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:51,800
Of your capital, that is one way
I can guarantee you will make

1077
01:00:51,800 --> 01:00:54,360
more capital mate.
Roll them out right.

1078
01:00:54,360 --> 01:00:56,400
Now heater give me a.
Rig.

1079
01:00:57,400 --> 01:00:59,120
Give us a rig.
Oh, better.

1080
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:01,400
No one else does it.
I love it.

1081
01:01:01,440 --> 01:01:02,000
Yeah.
So.

1082
01:01:02,240 --> 01:01:04,440
Funny, how good is it?
I'm so happy all my stocks are

1083
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:05,920
going up.
I'm fucking loving it.

1084
01:01:06,280 --> 01:01:09,400
Never been up here.
I love the correlation.

1085
01:01:09,400 --> 01:01:12,560
Between share price movements
and your mood, it's great.

1086
01:01:14,120 --> 01:01:16,840
Accept me Uranium 1.
That that hasn't gone up, but

1087
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,200
soon, hopefully.
Knock on wood, right?

1088
01:01:20,200 --> 01:01:21,920
Oh.
Sensational thanks for joining

1089
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:22,960
us Ali J.
So a pleasure.

1090
01:01:22,960 --> 01:01:27,040
I'd be backwards.
Just go gold, see if it's.

1091
01:01:27,040 --> 01:01:28,960
A lithium or.
Uranium deal, you wouldn't have

1092
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:32,240
come in, but a gold yeah, yeah,
gotta gotta.

1093
01:01:32,240 --> 01:01:33,560
Show my.
Face.

1094
01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:35,840
That's it right now.
Thanks, Jodie.

1095
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:39,640
And thanks to all the bloody
partners as always, 100 bucks

1096
01:01:39,640 --> 01:01:42,600
off your underground operators
tickets get them while they're

1097
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:44,520
still there.
They're running out because

1098
01:01:44,520 --> 01:01:46,880
they're we've sold so many, but
they're still there.

1099
01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:50,400
Bloody bargain of a lifetime.
Yeah, Great Partners Mineral

1100
01:01:50,400 --> 01:01:54,320
Mining Services, Grounded Sandy
Ground Sports, our insurance, K

1101
01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:58,120
drill, WA water balls, Sweat
Quattro, project engineer and

1102
01:01:58,120 --> 01:02:00,560
Cross Boundary Energy Hooteroo
Hooteroo.

1103
01:02:00,680 --> 01:02:02,840
Hooteroo guys, nothing like
green on screen.

1104
01:02:04,560 --> 01:02:07,200
Information contained in this.
Episode of Money of Mine is of

1105
01:02:07,200 --> 01:02:09,280
general nature only and does not
take into account the

1106
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:12,880
objectives, financial situation
or needs of any particular

1107
01:02:12,880 --> 01:02:14,920
person.
Before making any investment

1108
01:02:14,920 --> 01:02:17,960
decision, you should consult
with your financial advisor and

1109
01:02:17,960 --> 01:02:21,120
consider how appropriate the
advice is to your objectives,

1110
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,320
financial situation and needs.