What does the future hold for MinRes?

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Righto buddy bonders is lithium
back if MMS tip and dirt in the

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bloody Mount Holland crusher it
must be that must be.

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Is that a bloody clear signal?
MMS have a look at this.

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Rinse the ROM contract for Mount
Holland rock Breakers.

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Look at this.
Jeez that's a freaking sexy

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loader.
Good work MMS, good to see

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people like W farmers.
Taking action, understanding how

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to make money is to use the
right contract.

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Yeah, well done.
You could tell blue chip

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companies, you know, they do the
right thing.

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I.
Think with him back yet though.

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But you know this is this is a
balance sheet to write.

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Today this could, this could
wipe out every other producer

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potentially, right?
So you wouldn't believe it.

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We're probably talking about min
res today also got.

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It's like you wouldn't have
picked it, would ya?

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No, they haven't been in the
headline.

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Probably do it first too.
Yeah, Yeah, right.

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You've got a you've got an
interesting Kiwi project going

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on with the Siren Gold
Federation thing.

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Mate, this is right up my alley,
you know, yeah, bit of a bit of

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hostility, bit of contested
acquisition of sorts.

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I like it how you said that.
Yeah, I like it.

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What else we got?
We got Paladin's Quarterly, West

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Gold's could a bit of IGI missed
a couple, but lucky or unlucky.

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Then however you view it, let's
start with men Rez.

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What have we got today?
A bit of an announcement, 1

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pager from the company with
you'd say a bit of a different

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tone to last week.
Take it away and let's dissect

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what's going on in this.
Well, one of you would say one

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of it's one of the biggest
stories in corporate Australia

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that we've seen for a while,
you'd say.

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Absolutely.
Apparently on the East Coast,

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everyone's concerned with the
Richard White because it's all

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of the gossip of the, you know,
Sydney, the Sydney, you know,

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elites.
But here mate, this is this is

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important.
One min Rez doesn't make it on

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the Mamma Mia podcast.
I don't.

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Think actually, disappointingly,
the West is like nowhere to be

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seen on the reporting of this
might have something to do with

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the fact that, you know, it's a
bit advertised, big advertised,

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but anyway.
Yeah, so the the good friends we

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got at the Finn dust off the old
word personality again.

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I think we were a Jew, Jew, one
of them.

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Like you say Maddie, big, big
story.

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I reckon this is one of the
biggest ones in our world for

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for quite some time.
And yeah, we actually we

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actually haven't spoken about it
since last Monday and quite a

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bit more water has gone under
the bridge since then.

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So most most notably the the
stock price is down 25 odd

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percent the Friday before the
news came out.

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So that's sort of a week and a
half ago now close to 46 bucks.

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Now last time I looked closer to
34 bucks.

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That is a that's a pretty hefty
drop in just a week.

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So I think the the key talking
points for us are the the

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Company Announcement like you
said today, the one pager, the

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latest news, a lot of that
coming out of the AFR plus what

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we think is going to happen
next.

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I think a few people might be
came to hear the the uneducated

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or maybe partially educated
thoughts we have on on that

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topic.
I suppose interesting when you

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say it did drop back, remember
it like it did go down to 30

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bucks and then there was the you
know, all the China news even on

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the back of lithium not doing
too much, which saw it go back

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up to 50.
So it's sort of I even after all

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this back to where it started
after the initial drop when

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there was the.
Aussie Super was buying on the

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way up and now they're selling.
Also saw actually the the short

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position, the natural position
dropped a bit over the past week

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or so.
So that's sort of spiked up to

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like 12 1/2 percent of shares on
issue now closer to 10, which is

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kind of an interesting side
note.

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But so we'll kick things off.
Last week around mid last week

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again, there was reporting done
by Neil Chenawerth at the AFR.

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This was regarding a company
called Halfway Bay Station.

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So it's a property just South of
Queenstown in New Zealand and

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there's a company of the of the
same name.

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This is Co owned by Chris
Ellison and Tim Roberts who was

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a former board member of Mineral
Resources, a 7525% split.

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They allegedly bought machinery
below market value from a

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mineral Resources subsidiary.
This transaction was approved by

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the former MINS chair Peter Wade
who was involved in those

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earlier transactions with Far
East.

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Those allegations that was
initially put forward by Neil

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Chenoweth.
Saturday a week ago, Tim Roberts

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came out in a statement and said
at no time was plant and

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equipment purchased at
undervalued from a subsidiary of

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Mineral Resources.
Followed up and said at no time

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did I request Minres to supply
plant and equipment at a

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discount.
Now, part of the reason this

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came to light was the
whistleblowing by Steve Picotso.

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This guy's the former
procurement boss at Minrez.

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He was sacked for misconduct in
2022.

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Minrez followed up that sacking
by suing him for contract

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breach.
He in turn sued Minrez for

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unfair dismissal.
And this case is sort of subject

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to a lot of suppression orders,
so it's pretty light on details.

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I think he he was the
whistleblower and then the

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details of his whistleblowing
were subject to suppression

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orders and have struggled to
make their way to light.

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I think that is right because
that was pretty, you know,

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pretty widely reported at the
time as well.

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In 2022, we saw articles in the
West in the fin of this guy.

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I forgot.
So leaving and having a bit of a

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spat with the company.
Are those court those court

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cases ongoing or were they?
I'm not.

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Sure.
It's been pretty minimally

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reported, to be honest.
I think like Sydney Morning

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Herald are the only ones that
are still, like, talking about

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it.
Yeah, yeah.

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So that kind of brings us that
kind of brings us to today's

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announcement.
And so in a nutshell, you've got

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an update on the investigation.
Mints has been queried by the

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ASX as well.
They said they'll address that

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separately and shortly.
Additionally, Mints will advise

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the market read the the
conclusions that the board comes

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up with by November 4th.
So that's one week.

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They've also engaged Herbert
Smith Free Mills, the previously

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unnamed law firm.
Now, it was sort of reported by

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one group that these guys came
into the fold late last year,

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although another source
challenged this, saying it was

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only a few months ago.
So it was a bit of a a bit of

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disagreement on when they were
exactly pulled in the.

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Interesting thing JD was that
McGraw and Nicola are now being

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like put in the mix too.
So you know clearly some

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forensic accounting kind of
assessing like your storage

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transactions and everything is
is going in.

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Yeah.
And I also mentioned the general

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Counsel, without actually naming
them.

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Another detail is that Chris
Ellison is on planned leave.

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And lastly, the board said that
they're also now working to

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resolve inconsistencies in
what's being reported by the

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media.
So it's a sort of expansion of

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the investigation that's been
underway.

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So I think the first thing that
that's understands out that we

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should chat about, guys is the
change in tone, the kind of

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change in language.
There's no longer that full

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support for Mr Ellison and his
leadership, those words gone

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that that really stands out.
I'm not sure if you guys had

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different thoughts on that
matter, but just reading the the

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relatively brief one page they
come up with today, it's it

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strikes quite a different tone.
And the fact that they said by

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Monday, November 4th next week,
there will be effectively what

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the decision is going forward
of, I assume mostly in regards

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to Mr Ellison himself and the
position within the company.

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Yeah, keep in mind that the they
were scheduled to do their

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quarterly, I can't remember what
day was, but they pushed it back

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to the very last day of the
month.

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So it's now a normally report
before Pilbara and now reporting

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after on the on the 31st
Halloween then and then shortly

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after that you've got the 4th of
November where this information

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is all due.
So yeah, there's a, yeah,

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interesting confluence of sort
of circumstances ahead on the

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timing perspective.
I agree with you JD that the

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wording was different.
It was probably still like,

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yeah, I wouldn't describe it as
like as as as as a strong

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position by the board.
I would probably just describe

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it as like a reactionary
position by the board given you

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know the external pressure both
from clearly the media but also

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even ASX have have given them a
please explain with a bunch of

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questions I've got to type up
and now relates to the ASX too.

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Yeah, I'm I'm in agreeance with
you there mate.

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The the word strong wouldn't be
the first ones that that come to

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mind reading this response.
I think they've bought

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themselves a bit more time, but
you know, they've they've got

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the clock ticking now.
They've only got one week to go.

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There was also interestingly, no
mention of, you know, in

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quotation marks, private tax
matters.

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That's how they addressed it a
week ago.

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It it's clearly not that.
And that leads, you know, my

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part to a couple more questions.
Given the timing of when the

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board knew about these Far East
related dealings, it seems like

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they had known for a while,
which makes me sort of pose the

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question, why did they call it
just a private tax matter last

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Monday given everything that
gone on?

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And yeah, just hoping they
address that point when they

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come out next week and report on
it.

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And I think again, you know,
credit to, to Neil in the

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reporting he's done.
He, he summarised it in another

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article late last week quite
well, just sort of putting 2

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questions forward to the board,
2 core questions as he put it.

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Firstly being when did the board
find out about these events and

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following that up with why
didn't they tell shareholders at

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the time?
And you know, I think that's a

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nice and succinct way of putting
the, you know, the, the huge

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amount of questions that a lot
of people would have forward to

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the board, very keen to sort of
see what they come up with on

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that front.
But like you say, Maddie, the,

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the announcement we're kind of
leading to is what is the future

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hold for Chris Ellison?
And this sort of ties in with an

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article we saw over the weekend
from the Australian's data room

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column.
They floated around the idea of

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a, a circuit breaker, as they
called it, and they referenced

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the situation that's happened at
Wise Tech, the Aussie tech

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company Different, but you know,
quite similar.

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And ultimately what they ended
up doing was changing the role

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of their founder.
The stock bounced back 12% on

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the day.
Now he's still at the company in

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a sort of consult consulting
role, earning I think $1,000,000

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a year.
So it's it's not all that bad.

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Mind you, the guy's worth close
to $15 billion.

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But that circuit breaker is
something that the market really

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liked.
And you can see by the way the

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the stock rebounded, their stock
had equally peeled off 25 plus

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percent over the week.
Now, when it comes to kind of

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potential replacements that the
Australian puts forward, they've

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got a few interesting names.
I'd love to hear what you guys

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kind of think.
I think I've got my own views on

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it, but Andrew Cole, Sandy
Biswas and Nevada Power, I find

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all of them very much long
shots.

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I don't know why they would put
their hat in the ring here, but

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what do you guys kind of reckon
on that point?

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00:10:56,800 --> 00:10:59,440
I wouldn't put much weight to
either of them.

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Throw a gown into run.
Mean Reds?

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00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:02,080
No.
Pretty.

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Unlikely.
That brings back the question

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who?
Who is going to put their name

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in the ring?
I don't know.

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I think you don't necessarily
like have have someone else

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lined up like the the board will
have a decision, does Bill stay

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or does Bill go And I don't
actually think you will have a

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candidate lined up at the point.
You feel like Chris?

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00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,280
Yeah, now we know who you want
to put in there.

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Trap that was leading to my bit.
Keep it in there.

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That's fucking hilarious.
Yeah, I mean, that's the

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00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:35,960
elephant in the room.
And that one's done a done a few

227
00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:38,440
rumours.
But I wonder how much of that,

228
00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:45,200
you know, people on the long
side trying to push, trying to,

229
00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:49,240
you know, create a bit of an
outcome for min raise going

230
00:11:49,240 --> 00:11:55,040
forward to throw develop into
min raise and bill run the PO

231
00:11:55,560 --> 00:11:59,680
Bill Bayment run the pro forma.
But it's where the bill wants to

232
00:11:59,680 --> 00:12:02,960
do that, is the You'd have to
ask him, I'd reckon I.

233
00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:05,840
Reckon probably more is probably
more wishful thinking from the

234
00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:08,120
fundies.
Like you say, Maddie, it's that

235
00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:10,360
would seem like a bit of AI
think he'd run a process.

236
00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:12,160
I think you would if you if
you'd if the board comes to a

237
00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:14,480
decision that Chris has got to
go, you say, OK, we're running a

238
00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:16,080
proper process for a
replacement.

239
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,120
Like, yeah.
I think wouldn't, wouldn't you,

240
00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:24,320
But you don't have to do you but
like by by what by shareholders

241
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:26,720
would it be like you have to you
would have to actually run a

242
00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:29,920
proper process or not or you
don't have to.

243
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:34,640
I just think this is a board
that is under pressure to prove

244
00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:38,240
that they're doing the like,
governance by the book.

245
00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:40,480
And I think governance by the
book in this instance is not to

246
00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:45,280
have, you know, some anointed
person run the on the performer.

247
00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:49,920
It's actually to source the best
candidate from as far and wide

248
00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:51,000
as you can.
Yeah.

249
00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:53,680
I also think Maddie to that to
that question.

250
00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:58,360
I remember reading a bunch back
sort of about 10 years ago when

251
00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:03,000
Uber had a a debacle as well,
you know, famous founder leaving

252
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,760
and what what stood out, what in
the reading there was that the

253
00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:09,920
person coming in has a lot of
power by drawing out the

254
00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,200
process.
Minres is in in pain and it's

255
00:13:12,320 --> 00:13:15,400
it's not a good look for them.
So for them negotiating their

256
00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:18,360
own comp package, those sorts of
things, their incentive

257
00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:21,840
structures, once they get in
place, not signing the dotted

258
00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:26,760
line, you know, in in one week's
time, hypothetically is a is a

259
00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:28,520
smarter way to kind of go about
it for them.

260
00:13:28,520 --> 00:13:31,120
And you know, on the flip side
of that, they'll be strongly

261
00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:35,680
incentivized then to have the
best outcome for min rays and

262
00:13:35,680 --> 00:13:37,120
themselves, whoever that might
be.

263
00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:39,920
It's just a a side thought on
the on the topic there.

264
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,680
Yeah, I wouldn't, I wouldn't
rule it out completely, but you

265
00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,440
know something, something is
going to have to happen.

266
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,760
But to, to make that happen,
that's a lot of that ain't the

267
00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:54,000
next week Jobby like you got to
roll something, you got to do a

268
00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:57,000
scheme or, or whatever and
actually implement it.

269
00:13:57,000 --> 00:14:00,800
Like it's not a it's a there'd
be if like, and that's the

270
00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:01,840
thing, there's a lot of ifs
here.

271
00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:04,200
It's all like it's, it's, it's
allegations.

272
00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:08,800
It's nothing's been proven yet.
Nothing has been decided yet.

273
00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,880
And there'd be a, if it was,
there'd be a big interim period

274
00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:15,920
before something like that would
be able to happen because

275
00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:18,120
there's so many moving parts to
make it that way.

276
00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:23,440
But it's, but as, as we said,
this is completely separate to

277
00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:30,560
the weight prices and financial
pressure like 2 separate issues

278
00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:33,240
into what?
Yeah, yeah.

279
00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:35,160
It's the management premiums
gone.

280
00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:38,800
It has.
Yeah.

281
00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:40,880
I think we might have been
getting ahead of ourselves.

282
00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:43,600
The better question to ask is,
should Chris go?

283
00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:47,640
Does he need to go?
Does the board need to send him

284
00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:53,800
on his way or does it depend?
Yeah, my, I mean, my view with

285
00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:57,320
everything that's come out is
that him leaving would be the

286
00:14:57,320 --> 00:15:00,400
right thing to do.
I mean, like, who am I to kind

287
00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:04,200
of comment on what Chris Ellison
has built?

288
00:15:04,200 --> 00:15:08,560
He's done a phenomenal job, you
know, but if you're picking to

289
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:12,360
back a founder LED company or
not, I'd always go like out of

290
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,600
the two always go founder.
He's done a a really incredible

291
00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:16,920
job.
But I just think everything

292
00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:20,240
that's kind of come out and how
damaging it's been for the

293
00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:23,640
company.
And again it's that point of the

294
00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:27,320
allegations put forward.
So if they are proven to be true

295
00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:31,880
that it was money that would
have been profit of Minres went

296
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,880
into the pocket of that Far East
entity, then I think the outcome

297
00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:38,480
would be that he has to leave.
But you know, with the with the

298
00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:42,760
caveat of that has to be proven
and you know, that needs to be

299
00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:45,320
presented to the market.
Daddy, what do you reckon?

300
00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:47,760
Oh yeah, completely agree with
you.

301
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:53,720
Essentially like it's yeah,
innocent until proven guilty.

302
00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:58,680
But the, the, the timeline to
prove these things is usually

303
00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:05,720
very, very, very elongated.
But will they make a decision to

304
00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:10,200
retain him during that process
and trying out why the

305
00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:13,960
potential, you know, PR that has
on the company?

306
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:18,920
Yeah, I would think not.
But the one thing I'd I'd add in

307
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:23,320
there is that what's been
reported is that he went to the

308
00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:27,360
Ato, you know, a session
essentially in admittance that

309
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:30,240
this had happened.
So it would just need to be that

310
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:35,800
those, you know, those documents
are shared so people can see

311
00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:39,040
like ASIC and others can see
what happened.

312
00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:40,960
Like these things.
Yeah, like you say, generally do

313
00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:45,640
take a long time, but it does
appear from from what Neil's

314
00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:48,960
sort of reported it at the Fin
that a lot of this has sort of

315
00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,520
been written in stone already in
the past.

316
00:16:51,520 --> 00:16:55,040
So yeah, again, we're in a bit
of the dark on that one, but

317
00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:57,000
that's kind of how I see it at
the moment.

318
00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:04,200
Was was the the lightest 1, the
New Zealand, the New Zealand

319
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:08,920
side of it?
Was that, was that disclosed to

320
00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:12,359
the ITO as part of you said or
was that just the Far East side

321
00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,440
that was disclosed to the IT
discussed with the ITI from?

322
00:17:17,079 --> 00:17:22,000
How I understood it, that wasn't
included in the previous docs

323
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:26,720
because that didn't have the
same tax avoidance nature to it.

324
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,120
It was just dealing with a min
raise subsidiary.

325
00:17:30,840 --> 00:17:32,720
Yeah, yeah.
And then this is what happens

326
00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:38,000
when the the the all the outlets
are hyper focused on this except

327
00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:43,400
the West, as you said, but that
new things keep coming up. 100%,

328
00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:48,160
I think that's the fear you have
as yeah, a shareholder, blah,

329
00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:51,160
blah, blah, blah is the moment
the spotlight is shone on some

330
00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:52,680
things.
You're worried that this is the

331
00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:54,680
tip of the iceberg.
And what's beneath the iceberg

332
00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:57,720
is that is more is more stuff
that can surface.

333
00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:00,720
And that's been the pattern so
far since the first kind of

334
00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,680
investigative piece from Neil is
like every day or every two

335
00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,920
days, there's something new that
emerges.

336
00:18:06,120 --> 00:18:10,120
And I wouldn't be surprised to
see more come out and I wouldn't

337
00:18:10,120 --> 00:18:13,320
be surprised to see the severity
of the things that come out

338
00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:14,600
escalate.
Yeah.

339
00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,920
So I think the the last thing
just to sort of pass comment on

340
00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:22,160
is how proxies and major
shareholders will see the

341
00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:24,680
situation.
So they were the Super funds,

342
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:28,280
obviously a big deal on the ASX
were holding circa 30% of the

343
00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:31,200
business.
And the Chairman, James

344
00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:34,280
Mcclements has been reportedly
going around speaking to the

345
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:38,080
institutional shareholders.
The likes of L1 Aussie Supers we

346
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:43,480
touched on earlier early are
there and just trying to ease

347
00:18:43,560 --> 00:18:46,920
their fears over the governments
within the business.

348
00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,480
Also been reported a couple
months ago that ownership

349
00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:51,840
matters.
They they hadn't been happy.

350
00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:53,200
That's spoken out in the past
there.

351
00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:56,680
Of course, a big proxy advisor
and in and amongst the dates we

352
00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,040
spoke about with the, the
quarterly, the timeline the

353
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:02,120
board has put on themselves.
You've also got the AGM coming

354
00:19:02,120 --> 00:19:04,680
up on November 1st.
So I think you'd be paying

355
00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,040
pretty short odds that there'd
be a fair few votes against a

356
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:11,040
couple resolutions.
Ones that kind of stand out is

357
00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:14,320
the adoption of the R.E.M.
Report and the approval of a

358
00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:18,360
grant for the grant of
securities to Chris Ellison.

359
00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:20,720
You know, this is a way for
shareholders to air their

360
00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:24,280
discontent with the business.
Ultimately that voting against

361
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:28,760
these things might not lead to a
huge outcome, but it'd just be

362
00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:32,960
kind of interesting to see which
way the proxies are voting and

363
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,560
therefore the institutional
shareholders are voting on the

364
00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:38,560
matter.
Yeah, I reckon, I actually

365
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,920
reckon that the, the performance
rights to to Alison will get

366
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:45,400
withdrawn before the IGMI.
Just think they'll be in, you

367
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,960
know, amendment.
Yeah, could, could be on the

368
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:50,320
money on that one.
I don't think it's.

369
00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:56,640
A good look, yeah.
But the other thing I just want

370
00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,760
to say to them, any of the money
miners, if you're, if you've got

371
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:04,160
any information that we should
be aware of, feel free to send

372
00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:06,800
it through to
us.jc@moneymine.com, but be very

373
00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,320
curious.
Absolutely.

374
00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:12,880
I think we'll wrap that one by
saying LEGC is a shareholder.

375
00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:14,800
Ding, Ding, Ding.
Ding Ding Ding.

376
00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:16,800
We'll we'll strictly Fact Check
it.

377
00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:19,880
Absolutely.
Right trap.

378
00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:24,880
Next up, Sauron Goldmat.
What is going on in Go Go the

379
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:27,080
All Blacks?
Go the All Blacks yeah, Sauron

380
00:20:27,080 --> 00:20:31,240
gold there in ASX listed Yeah,
New Zealand gold kind of

381
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,320
exploration hopeful.
It's the second time in two

382
00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:37,320
weeks that Sauron Gold has has
disclosed that the superior

383
00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:41,120
offer has come on their table
just hours before a shareholder

384
00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:43,920
meeting to vote on.
And a great deal already.

385
00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,240
So in in this case, you know,
both times it's been with with

386
00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:48,960
rural Gold.
But the story gets interesting

387
00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:52,440
because I might even end up
making my way to the shareholder

388
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,880
vote this afternoon at 3:00 PM.
Ought to be rude not to,

389
00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:55,600
wouldn't it?
It would.

390
00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,920
I'll do the edit, it's all.
Good and the the Siren

391
00:20:59,920 --> 00:21:02,040
shareholders they're they're
scheduled to vote on the

392
00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,560
transaction with this TSXV
listed rural gold.

393
00:21:04,560 --> 00:21:07,640
The only problem is that Aussie
super backed Federation mining

394
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:09,800
wants them to do a different
deal.

395
00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:12,280
The whole conundrum actually
reminds me a little bit of the

396
00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:16,880
Battle for Leonora where there
was a hostile kind of scenario

397
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:20,800
for the Leonora assets and at
the time it appeared St Barbara

398
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:23,880
management were pretty wedded to
selling to Genesis instead of

399
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:25,680
Silver Lake.
You were publicly disclosing

400
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:27,320
that they wanted to potentially
pay more.

401
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:30,920
It was still conditional in this
case, Siren Gold really wants to

402
00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,680
sell their reefs and project to
rural gold.

403
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:35,800
Meanwhile Federation Mining
wants them to keep it and

404
00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:40,840
instead be the vehicle that kind
of RT OS Federation to list onto

405
00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,680
the ASX.
And this is this is particularly

406
00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,280
interesting because Federation
Mining isn't listed themselves.

407
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:50,360
So unlike Silver Lake in the
president I just mentioned

408
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:53,280
Federation, they can't exactly
put out an ASX announcement

409
00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:56,800
about their bid.
Instead, the details have found

410
00:21:56,800 --> 00:22:01,280
their way to the AFR twice.
So it it appears to me that you

411
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:03,160
know, deal makers on the
federation side are, are are

412
00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:06,320
frustrated at the lack of
engagement from Siren and the

413
00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:09,560
the media is is the way to put
the pressure on them.

414
00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,200
That I'll play book I that'll
play been around forever will be

415
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:19,800
for the rest of time an.
Initial deal with Rua was

416
00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:22,040
agreed.
Then kind of two weeks ago it

417
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:24,280
emerged in the IFR that
Federation had an alternative

418
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,480
deal penned to Siren that they
weren't getting much engagement

419
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,600
on.
Then hours before Siren,

420
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,280
shareholders were actually meant
to vote on the deal with Rua.

421
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:36,680
Rua, it appeared, had lifted
their bid and and this Siren

422
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,040
shareholder meeting got
postponed.

423
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:39,840
Imagine that the lift was sort
of to butt out.

424
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,040
Any chance that the the other
deal was a bit better?

425
00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,080
And now it appears Federation
has also lifted their bid.

426
00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:47,480
But Siren's board is kind of
adamant that, you know, the

427
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:48,720
rural transactions, the better
one.

428
00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:51,920
And they kind of refuse to, to,
to engage or, or postpone the

429
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,880
vote, which is happening today
as at the time we're recording,

430
00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:57,960
you know, this podcast.
So what?

431
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,440
What are the two?
Explain the two bids.

432
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:01,880
Which ones?
Yeah.

433
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:03,400
Different, better, worse.
Yeah.

434
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:07,120
In a nutshell, the best bid from
Rural Gold, which is the one

435
00:23:07,120 --> 00:23:10,880
being kind of voted on by Siren
shareholders at 3:00 PM Perth

436
00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:15,080
time today, would have Siren
selling their reefs and project

437
00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:18,680
for about $20 million in cash
and mostly script in Rua.

438
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:24,440
Effectively, Siren would end up
owning 30% of Rua gold for

439
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,720
offloading their reefs and
project, but they'd still retain

440
00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:30,160
their Sam's Creek project.
The latest bid from Federation

441
00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:34,880
on the other hand though, it
would be an, an RTO where SORN

442
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:39,440
shareholders end up actually
owning 17.5% of the pro forma.

443
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:43,520
That includes Federation Mining
and Federation Mining.

444
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:45,760
That's like a much more
advanced, they've got reserves,

445
00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,520
they've got, you know,
development down down to the ore

446
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:49,720
body.
They still need to build a mill,

447
00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:53,120
but Aussie soup is there and can
can kind of write a cheque to

448
00:23:53,120 --> 00:23:56,920
help underwrite the the CapEx
required to actually see that

449
00:23:56,920 --> 00:23:57,880
through.
Yeah.

450
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,680
So, so why do you, why do you
think they're actually not

451
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:05,480
entertaining this Federation
deal, which sounds compelling?

452
00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:08,560
Yeah, I think the compelling
part of the Federation deal,

453
00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:12,280
it's like 17.5% is a pretty big
uplift from where the first

454
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:14,280
offer that was sort of leaked
was.

455
00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,280
It's like a 70% uplift.
But it's it's kind of the the

456
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:20,920
vehicle like Federation being
RTO, having Aussie super sort of

457
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:23,600
back it having a pathway to
actually being production in

458
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:27,040
this kind of gold market.
It's kind of interesting, yeah.

459
00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:30,360
Like I, I think you can eat your
heart out with the with theories

460
00:24:30,360 --> 00:24:33,800
on on why it hasn't been
entertained and a lot of sort of

461
00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:36,480
common sense theories might be
the right theories to to go

462
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,960
with.
You know, the board is putting

463
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,640
forward the conditionality of
the of the federation offer as a

464
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:45,600
as a reason, one of the reasons
why, you know, it's not up to

465
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,400
scratch, but like every offer is
conditional on undue diligence,

466
00:24:49,400 --> 00:24:51,000
of course.
And I think what, what sirens

467
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:55,480
board should be doing right now
is deferring the vote with real

468
00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:56,600
gold.
But call it, call it like a

469
00:24:56,600 --> 00:25:00,600
month, then give, give
federation like 2 weeks to

470
00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,360
conduct their due diligence
required for their bid to be

471
00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:07,400
unconditional, to allow its
offer to, you know, to reach,

472
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:09,960
you know, to DD to be done
becomes unconditional.

473
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:13,200
And then once you've got the
deal capable of being, you know,

474
00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:15,600
unconditional or not or
comparably conditional between

475
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,000
the two, let shareholders
determine the best, the best one

476
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,640
on the table.
Because yeah, the, the thing

477
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,440
that stands out to me a bit like
dog bottles is in today's

478
00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,640
announcement, you can see the
board recommendation.

479
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,840
They've based it off the
recommendation from only three

480
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:34,040
of the four directors.
They say MD Victor Rajasuriya

481
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,760
was sidelined from voting
because of his material personal

482
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,720
interest in the matter due to
his holding of performance

483
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:40,840
rights.
In Siren.

484
00:25:41,160 --> 00:25:45,040
In Siren now Victor, he does
have 13 million performance

485
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:48,040
rights, but I don't know if I've
ever seen a director idled from

486
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:50,520
the decision because they have
performance rights.

487
00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:53,000
This is probably the first time
I've I've actually seen seen

488
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,360
that.
You'd think they'd want to make

489
00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:57,720
the better decision, like they'd
be more incentivized to make a

490
00:25:57,720 --> 00:25:58,520
good decision.
Well.

491
00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,360
Performance rights vest on a
change of control and in the in

492
00:26:01,360 --> 00:26:04,560
the case of the ruler
transaction, there's no change

493
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,160
of control.
So, and yeah, so like you, you

494
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:10,840
could come up with a, a
defensible theory for maybe why

495
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:13,720
there's a conflict, but I just
don't think it's a very like

496
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,200
sensible conflict to point out.
Or actually, I think it's quite

497
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:20,800
hypocritical because if if you
look at the, you know, just the

498
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:25,600
annual report of, of Siren, you
can see that two of the three

499
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,240
remaining directors that were
part of the the group that said,

500
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:29,640
yes, we recommend the rule
transaction.

501
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:33,960
Well, well, they, they're
clipping about $200,000 each in

502
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,960
related party transactions.
One of them gets the money for

503
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,240
rent, admin and marketing
services and the other one gets

504
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,600
it for consulting services.
So the city can make can't help

505
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:45,280
but wonder if if if those
directors are truly without

506
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:47,240
conflict as well.
That seems like a conflict of

507
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:51,520
interest to me to want to retain
that annuity that comes in do

508
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:54,000
you as a result of staying in
control so.

509
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,800
And and so correct me if I'm
wrong, this fight that's

510
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,120
happening now, there would be
proxy votes that have already

511
00:27:00,120 --> 00:27:06,280
gone in for that vote, but there
is new information on what

512
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:09,160
alternative deal is out there,
yeah.

513
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:10,520
Right.
I think that, I mean that's the

514
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:15,720
big point is the, the, the vote.
Like for people who are voting

515
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,760
on the approval at the
shareholder meeting, they at the

516
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:22,120
time that they've submitted
their votes by proxy, keep in

517
00:27:22,120 --> 00:27:25,200
mind not many people actually
rock up to a physical meeting.

518
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:27,920
They normally submit their votes
before the deadline to submit

519
00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,600
them by proxy, which is normally
2 business days before the

520
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:33,960
actual meeting in person.
So anyone that's done that would

521
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,720
have no information of the best
deal on the table from

522
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:39,200
Federation.
So they've approved something

523
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,560
without knowledge of what the
best alternative actually is.

524
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,160
That's why I think the
responsible thing of the board

525
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:46,480
to do was actually to postpone
it so shareholders have a better

526
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:50,520
understanding of what the the
two options are and let them

527
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:52,560
vote with their own capital
rather than, you know, have

528
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:56,240
heck, like, you know, it's in
their own language, a conflicted

529
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:57,800
board telling you what they
should do.

530
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,240
They're right, anyway.
I'm going to go to the meeting

531
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:04,200
and see what happens.
Wonder if there'll be pastries

532
00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:10,120
there whereas it's just gonna be
the the Blen 43 and bickies

533
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:10,960
Don't know.
Let us know.

534
00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:15,040
I'm always keen, always keen to
know votes and AG Ms what the

535
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,600
food is.
I will let you know, that's my

536
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:20,920
big ticket.
Item Big Ticket Item the.

537
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:22,640
Food might be getting thrown
from side to side.

538
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,160
Look.
Forward to hearing what goes on

539
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:25,720
there.
Right?

540
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:32,560
Next up, Paladin buddy down 20%
today in early trade on the back

541
00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:35,520
of the quarterly.
The results, a recent Ding Ding,

542
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:37,520
Ding.
I bought the dip, Full

543
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:38,640
disclosure.
Bought the dip.

544
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:40,520
Interesting.
Tell me what you saw here that

545
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:43,080
yeah, that you thought maybe the
market didn't see.

546
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:45,520
I was like oh geez it's down.
It must be as cheaper than

547
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:51,560
Friday.
So remember the a lot of the

548
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:53,960
numbers will go through here are
on 100% basis.

549
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,280
Remember Paladin only owned 75%
of the laying of Heinrich Mine

550
00:28:57,280 --> 00:28:59,520
in Namibia.
The other quarters owned by

551
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:05,560
China Sea and and Sea.
So they were guiding for FY25 on

552
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:10,720
100% basis four to four and a
half, 1,000,000 lbs of U3O8 at a

553
00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:13,840
plant recovery of 85 to 90%.
But you can see what they've

554
00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:18,000
produced this quarter, it's
hasn't hasn't really hit the

555
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:19,840
mark yet.
So they only managed to produce

556
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:24,960
640,000 lbs and the plant
recovery was at 69%.

557
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:29,840
So I think that's been a big
driver for the market reaction

558
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,360
today.
So and look, they sided

559
00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,160
variability in the stockpile law
grade.

560
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:38,640
So I remember they're just
processing the old stockpiles.

561
00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:42,680
There's no mining going on here.
Delayed Commission in the second

562
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:47,000
classification circuit, lower
than anticipated tailings, water

563
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,680
recovery and you know, a couple
other things, additional

564
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:51,760
maintenance for the screens and
philtres.

565
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:55,640
So look and yeah, you look at
how much the cost lifted as

566
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:57,720
well, they're up to 42 bucks a
pound.

567
00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,360
But you know, lower output, poor
recoveries.

568
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,800
I'd bet $1,000,000 every time.
The costs are gonna be higher

569
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:06,960
usually.
Than than expectations.

570
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:10,400
Always, if you produce less
pounds for the same amount of

571
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:11,520
work, you're gonna have higher
costs.

572
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:15,720
So that's so, yeah, it hasn't
they and that 'cause they also

573
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:19,040
fell below the sort of the
required 1,000,000 tonne of

574
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,160
crusher throughput for the
quarter, that's what they sort

575
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:24,360
of need to be hitting.
They did indicate the crusher

576
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:27,760
upgrades did take place that
eliminated some previous

577
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,880
bottlenecks.
So all right.

578
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:35,800
And because if you look at the
cash flow report, you can see

579
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:38,800
sales revenue was 24.8 million
for the quarter.

580
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:41,800
But you look back at the June
quarterly, it was flagged and

581
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,560
that so that was the partial
advance payment for the off take

582
00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:50,440
agreement for the £320,000 that
they shipped on 12th of July

583
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:52,760
because I announced that at the
end of the quarterly and saying

584
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:56,040
sort of that was coming up.
So looks like from what I could

585
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:58,680
say they've produced for the
last two quarters in total of

586
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:02,680
about £1.2 million.
But it appears they've only been

587
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:07,600
paid for a bit over of 1/4 of it
so far because they they sell.

588
00:31:07,600 --> 00:31:13,720
I'm not and I'm not sure if that
assume that £320,000 was they

589
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:19,360
got paid and then you know 25%
goes to CNNC as the other

590
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:21,800
owners.
So because they've they sold

591
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,520
600, it says they sold 620,000
lbs during the quarter.

592
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:31,480
I'm assuming the £320,000
partial is part of that is being

593
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,360
included in that.
But they've only been paid, they

594
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:37,320
haven't been paid for everything
they've sold in the quarter.

595
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:39,920
Gotcha.
Because that, that the only cash

596
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,600
receipt exactly matches what
they disclosed in the June

597
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,400
quarterly report.
So effectively they've produced

598
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:50,840
£1.2 million, sold about half of
it, but only being paid for 1/4

599
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,800
of it with cash in the door.
That's that's how I interpret

600
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:54,280
it.
So the.

601
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:56,680
Prepayment they would have
gotten the money in the door

602
00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:59,640
ages ago for.
That Nah, they, it said they got

603
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:03,760
the pre it said they've, they
shipped it on the I think it was

604
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,640
12th of July or something and
received a prepayment.

605
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:08,760
Or the partial part of.
Yeah.

606
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:12,200
But and that that that
prepayment has been included in

607
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:15,120
this quarterly.
It was just mentioned in last

608
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,280
quarterly 'cause it happened,
you know, just a couple of weeks

609
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:23,600
after the end of the quarter.
So look, there's possibly around

610
00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:28,800
£800,000 still to be paid for
that has been produced in what

611
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:32,200
they've got.
So, you know, 75 bucks a pound,

612
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:37,040
that's about their 75% share
will be US 45,000,000 revenue,

613
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,320
'cause they like, you look at
it, you're like they're just

614
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:42,360
processing stockpiles.
That's and they're losing money.

615
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,720
That's 100%.
That's literally I went, I

616
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:45,880
opened the cash flow statement
first.

617
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:47,880
I didn't read any of the words
in the quarterly and I'm like

618
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:49,280
how are they losing money from
processing?

619
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,680
Stock losses and it and it
appears like and it so it

620
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,880
appears even after it it must
have to they don't get paid till

621
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,200
it's well after it's shipped.
That's what that's what it's

622
00:32:57,200 --> 00:32:59,040
looking like.
So 'cause they 'cause they

623
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:03,760
increased their drawn debt from
70 US 70 to 95 million.

624
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:08,280
So they've got 55,000,000
unrestricted cash and 55 of

625
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,440
undrawn debt plus the 95 of of
drawn debt.

626
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:17,560
So, yeah, so there's obviously
that bit of that chunk of to

627
00:33:17,560 --> 00:33:20,280
sell and then obviously what
they're going to produce beyond

628
00:33:20,280 --> 00:33:22,080
that going forward as well.
So.

629
00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:24,960
And if the deal with Fission
completes, I imagine like you're

630
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,400
paying transaction costs, all
the success fees, all you

631
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:28,600
advise.
Yeah, yeah.

632
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:31,440
So I think, I think it'd be a
bit of chunky leakage coming out

633
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:33,520
of that.
So and look, 'cause they're

634
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:35,840
still, they're still in regards
to that fission deal, they're

635
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:40,280
still waiting on that Investment
Canada Act clearance, ICI, they

636
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,600
refer to it as on the back of
that national security review

637
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:46,440
that was called.
So 'cause the final court order

638
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,760
got approved for the
arrangement, but still waiting

639
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:51,040
on that ICI clearance to get
finalised.

640
00:33:51,040 --> 00:33:54,360
So 'cause I and I guess the
question is if, if, if it does

641
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:57,160
get approved, as I say the
disclaimer is in there, it's no

642
00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,120
guarantee it will get approved,
which means the arrangement

643
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:04,400
won't get approved.
It's like how will the pro forma

644
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,159
perform?
Because there's as I said,

645
00:34:08,159 --> 00:34:11,159
there's no there's no
geographical synergies with it

646
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:13,280
at all.
Like for the Paladin Fission,

647
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,960
they're obviously getting hold
of a development project in the

648
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:18,600
other basket basin plus the
other stuff.

649
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,880
But that's the, that's the key
thing is that the PLS project,

650
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:27,280
they will have cash flows coming
in for Langa Hein from Langa

651
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,280
Heinrich.
But big, a big development

652
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,120
project is a big CapEx bill and
a lot of permitting and a lot,

653
00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:36,719
lot far away.
But and look, they are scheduled

654
00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:41,880
to start mining at Lange
Heinrich, I think 2025 to

655
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,440
because of that, that'll take
them up to hopefully they're

656
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:47,199
aiming for £6 million a year
too.

657
00:34:47,199 --> 00:34:49,360
Much CapEx to spend to kick off
that mining.

658
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:53,120
Don't know.
Yeah, because I can be.

659
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:54,080
I'm thinking in my head, I
think.

660
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,520
Probably a cutback was up.
Yeah, I don't yeah, speculating

661
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,720
here without knowing the detail,
but if if cash is skin, I don't

662
00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:04,000
know they've got the debt and
stuff, but maybe the the Fusion

663
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:05,960
deal completing is also a
catalyst.

664
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:08,800
You can you can maybe raise some
money and say you're going to

665
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,360
spend it on progressing.
You know Fusion's PLS at the

666
00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:15,360
same time as as allocate some of
it to you cut back and.

667
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,920
Yeah, yeah.
And it's all price, bloody price

668
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:21,000
dependent.
I think they've got, was it 20

669
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:25,360
odd 1,000,000 lbs contracted out
to £23 million of production

670
00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:29,720
contracted through to 20-30, but
they're going to, what's that

671
00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:32,720
six, six years away, Their
shares going to be 4 1/2.

672
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:36,320
So that's pretty much most of
Paladin share contracted.

673
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,440
I think that's £6 million a
year.

674
00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,320
Maybe that's also part of the
reason they're the the 4th most

675
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,920
shorted stock on the exchange.
That's that's pretty hefty.

676
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:49,680
And you know, I'd be interested
to see after today whether some

677
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:52,680
of them are covering, you know,
using that you said down 20%

678
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,560
sort of bounce between there and
50 percent, 15%.

679
00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:57,080
So I wonder if there is a bit of
buying back.

680
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:01,560
But yeah, wonder if the thesis
was also in part maybe a capital

681
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:04,520
raising again, like you say.
Trevor, I'm saying that without

682
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:06,440
going too far into the weeds on
this one.

683
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:08,280
Yeah.
And and but it's just that it's

684
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:12,160
the age old you, you speak to
the the people running these

685
00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:15,240
companies.
The age old playbook is get your

686
00:36:15,240 --> 00:36:18,920
uranium market cap as big as
possible to get the ATF inflows.

687
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,960
And that that because that's
what drives a lot of this market

688
00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:26,200
with these, when you've got
these uranium, you've got such a

689
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:30,040
limited amount of producers
around the world in a sector

690
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,400
what there's, what is there
eight, I think been told, eight

691
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,560
people producing uranium around
the world.

692
00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:37,680
That are listed that you can
buy.

693
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:41,440
Yeah.
So it's not like, yeah, it's

694
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,000
just so it's such a different
commodity in that sense for the

695
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:46,240
Atfs that want their exposure to
production.

696
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:49,640
So and that's and that's just
what that's until there's a shit

697
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:52,560
load more coming on that's going
to be a lot of the driver

698
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:57,800
between behind equity movement
as as training price and fuck

699
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:00,680
ups.
As Kaylee kind of told us on on

700
00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:04,720
Friday's episode as well, maybe
a strategy that more miners in

701
00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:07,040
different commodities should
utilise as well, hey?

702
00:37:08,240 --> 00:37:09,600
What's that?
Have less of them.

703
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:15,080
Yeah, just just merge and buy a
scale, attract more generalist

704
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:19,160
funds and grow that way.
You know, it's, it's not a, a

705
00:37:19,160 --> 00:37:22,920
sort of feature completely
unique to the uranium market,

706
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:27,080
although the the ATS in uranium
land are pretty chunky, but

707
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,640
that, that lower band threshold
for the big money managers

708
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:33,560
around the world does chalk off
a lot of the mining companies

709
00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:35,960
that we talk about, I think.
When that happens, I, like I

710
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:39,200
said, the ETFs drag here your
share price beyond where true

711
00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:43,520
true value, you know, intrinsic
Navy is the you as a management

712
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:47,320
team, you've kind of got a
backfill value now through M&A

713
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:50,200
that's actually creative, which
is also hard to do when the

714
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:53,080
whole sector is sort of buoyant.
You got to yeah, you got to buy

715
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,320
stuff that looks cheaper and
backfilled value because flows

716
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,720
don't happen forever.
In fact, the generous flows, as

717
00:37:59,720 --> 00:38:02,440
fast as they come, they can't go
when the theme changes as well.

718
00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,320
So you cop it the the not a
stride on the upside.

719
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:08,880
But then you're, you're
vulnerable when the flows either

720
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:13,000
slow or or reverse that you
know, you're, you're

721
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:17,320
particularly kind of yeah, yeah.
I think it off and I think it's

722
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:21,160
and when you, I suppose when you
talk, it's all the it's from the

723
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,000
underlying that when you say the
theme, like the underlying theme

724
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,400
is like, what is your bet on
uranium and nuclear right now?

725
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:29,240
That's what that's what Paladin
is.

726
00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:33,160
And I guess with the all the
recent news about like, you

727
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:36,040
know, the whole data centre
thing wasn't really in the

728
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:39,320
initial thesis a year ago.
Now that's sort of being added

729
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:43,640
on top of the structural supply
deficit that everyone keeps

730
00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:46,120
talking about.
So it's yeah, it's going to be a

731
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:49,360
very interesting year in the
yellow cake, I think, or bloody.

732
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:54,240
Oh, I've I've never stuck to
enjoying something for so long.

733
00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:57,280
Fucking love uranium.
Oh boy, used to have ADD.

734
00:38:57,280 --> 00:38:59,440
I'll be like fool, I'm under
this now I'm back on the rare

735
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:04,160
earths.
But anyway another another

736
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,400
company with yellow on the logo.
Look at this yellow West gold.

737
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,440
Not mining uranium FYI, but they
could if they want it because

738
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:15,720
they've just increased their
bloody balance sheet strength,

739
00:39:15,720 --> 00:39:20,240
upped it by 200 bucks with this
with their existing lenders. 300

740
00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:22,400
mil in the bloody war chest now.
So are they?

741
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,040
Going to use it on Maddie.
That's a big question.

742
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:26,200
Kaydrill.
I reckon they're going to give a

743
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:28,120
shit load to Kaydrill for
organic growth.

744
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:31,080
Kaydrill.
Kaydrill punching some holes in

745
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:35,440
up at Makethera for Westguard.
So punching.

746
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:39,160
Using using guns to.
Punch using Ryan's hands like

747
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,920
he's like they've got the RC
going, he's like pre collar and

748
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:43,480
just beating the shit out of the
ground.

749
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:45,800
Just just manhandling the
district.

750
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:47,920
The legend that is Ryan
O'Sullivan.

751
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:50,880
Westguld's future now in the
hands of Ryan O'Sullivan.

752
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:55,040
I've never felt more comfortable
as an Australian citizen really

753
00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,400
for for anything bloody.
That's a tick from money of mine

754
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:01,960
for Westgard.
I wonder how they set these

755
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:05,360
records of yeah, like metres per
shift but.

756
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:09,640
Pretty Ryan's Ryan's are violent
pre colouring, just beating the

757
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:12,600
shit out of the ground and it's
just then she's just proficient.

758
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:14,760
Can't be unlocked through Maddie
Mechanical machinery.

759
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:16,880
No, it can't be Travis.
They're at.

760
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:19,280
Imark as well.
Oh mate, don't.

761
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,520
Forget ladies and gentlemen,
before you engaged K drill for

762
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:25,240
some arse and diamond holes just
like Westgard have made a good

763
00:40:25,240 --> 00:40:27,840
choice.
Go have a beer with this good

764
00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:29,440
looking guy.
Have a look at Druba.

765
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,000
You know why he's smiling?
Because he knows there's a few

766
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,280
schooners on the way over in
Sydney.

767
00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:37,640
Make sure you say g'day to Druba
and the team at iMac.

768
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:41,040
We're not gone by the way, even
though we're on the website.

769
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:43,320
I just found out.
Really.

770
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,720
We're going to the on Air page.
It's a big thing of us.

771
00:40:46,720 --> 00:40:48,680
No wonder everyone's been asking
if we're gone.

772
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:50,520
We're like.
Yeah, that makes a whole lot

773
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:54,680
more sense.
That makes a Oh God, I'm so used

774
00:40:55,720 --> 00:41:00,720
so yeah, that's extra the words
going around.

775
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,960
What's the money for for West
gold Pantoro keeps getting a

776
00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:09,120
bloody keeps getting a mention
700 odd $1,000,000 company.

777
00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:12,080
Now Pantoro, their market cap
since they've had the recent run

778
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:16,520
on on the gold price, obviously
got the the synergy with the

779
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:21,200
Higginsville mill down that way.
Whether even though Pantoro got

780
00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:23,640
their own mill, but there's
probably a lot of other

781
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:27,400
potential stuff to of Pantoros
to feed into the Higginsville

782
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:31,000
mill like there's obviously I
know they've probably been

783
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:32,040
doing.
I would assume they've been

784
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:35,280
doing DD on that for a while.
I don't know.

785
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:37,080
Yeah.
I think that one makes sense.

786
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,320
Like the facility was
interesting because basically

787
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,200
said, you know that and we've
got very little detail on the

788
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:45,960
terms or anything like that.
But it said that it expired if

789
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:49,000
not drawn down 30th of June
2025.

790
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:51,560
That to me you don't, There's
probably a commitment fee

791
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:52,960
involved in getting one of one
of these.

792
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,320
I don't think you get it unless
you have a plan to draw it down

793
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:58,160
in the, you know, in the like 6
odd months.

794
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:00,960
You've actually got to use the
thing 77 odd months so.

795
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,280
How would you go to the effort?
Yeah, it'd be interesting to see

796
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:08,160
if they're going to pay like in
whatever form, a billion for

797
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:10,000
Pantoro.
I don't know, don't know.

798
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:12,480
Yeah, sometimes when you talk
about things, the less chance

799
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,040
I've got of of happening.
But.

800
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:16,680
Maybe, yeah, maybe that's a new
technique for us.

801
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:18,440
The other one, The other one,
the other one that's

802
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:22,440
interesting, that's going on a
bloody run is Astral.

803
00:42:23,080 --> 00:42:25,840
Have a look at the bloody spark
chart of Astral.

804
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,640
That's she was up another
frigging 7 odd percent today

805
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:32,240
because they they got their
their Mandela projects just

806
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:34,400
that's just north of
Higginsville.

807
00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:39,920
So it's sort of you'd say it's
closer, closer to Higginsville

808
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:44,880
than Lakewood, but you know,
that's you know, what is it one

809
00:42:44,880 --> 00:42:46,680
point?
What is it?

810
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:50,440
1.2 million oz 1.27 million oz
at 1.1.

811
00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:53,560
So big pit, but yeah, I'd be
interested.

812
00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:55,920
That's I think what are they
kept at 100?

813
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:59,360
And 20.
On 20, yeah, it's on the no,

814
00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:04,760
it's on the spark chart, the
thingy, 179 on 79 now, yeah, So

815
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,880
you'd have to pay up, pay up a
bit for it, but it's a, you

816
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:11,480
know, Greenfields, Greenfields
project, so that'd be another

817
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:14,160
one I'd have me eye on there.
So what happens?

818
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:19,280
Yeah, Yeah, yeah, New person in
the district in Yeah, W cold.

819
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,920
So anything's on the table
Addie.

820
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:24,160
OK, Drew might just find a shit
load of.

821
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,040
Expression.
It could make sense to you.

822
00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,040
Yeah, there's yeah, it's me.
They're up the north at the

823
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:30,800
moment.
Wait till I get start punching

824
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:35,120
holes in down the South.
Holy snap and duck shit, right?

825
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:40,200
He's a, he's a we might be
seeing another bloody, another

826
00:43:40,200 --> 00:43:44,520
little deal coming up here.
The the detectives are bloody

827
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:48,840
not too hard to figure out.
I don't think you got Broadstar

828
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,880
and Orman both in trade and out
or Broadstar.

829
00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:55,160
Broadstar is actually suspended
from quotation on the back of

830
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,080
going into trading out end of
last week.

831
00:43:57,080 --> 00:44:01,880
But it was around speed and
ticket wasn't around any

832
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:04,920
transaction or anything.
But then Orman just went into

833
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:09,320
trading out today in relation to
commercial discussions with

834
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:11,880
respect to a potential joint
venture relating to the

835
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:13,920
Sandstone project.
OK.

836
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:22,520
So yeah, so I I would now you'd
think the logical play is

837
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:25,600
Broadstar because of obviously
the scheme of arrangement with

838
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:28,440
Alta the the gateway side of the
deal transactions being

839
00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:32,960
completed the 19th of November's
when the Alta deal gets scheme

840
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,880
gets voted on.
So just might be the next step

841
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:40,160
towards Santone Sandstone
consolidation possibly.

842
00:44:40,440 --> 00:44:41,600
They always had.
They always had that.

843
00:44:41,720 --> 00:44:45,640
Yeah, that little a little bit
of tenure where the mill used to

844
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:48,040
be in the sandstone district
there, and they've got like a

845
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:51,440
mineral resource that has kind
of, yeah, historically kind of

846
00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:54,920
copped a bit of flak for being a
tricky 1 to mine because it's so

847
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:57,200
skinny and so, so deep.
Yeah, I think it's only about

848
00:44:57,200 --> 00:44:59,840
100 metre strike length.
Yeah, but it looks like it

849
00:44:59,840 --> 00:45:02,000
looked at the hits.
It looks actually, I haven't

850
00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:04,200
gone too deep into it, but it
looks like it's got a bit of

851
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:05,720
thickness to it.
I think it was like it was.

852
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:10,520
There's 1300 oz per vertical
metre, so it wasn't yeah, but

853
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:12,920
there was, yeah.
I think that the resource .4

854
00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:14,960
metres at 9.3 grammes is one of
the hits.

855
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:17,080
I could be wrong but this I'm
pretty sure when I went to the

856
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:19,400
weeds and the resources this is
like back in 2020.

857
00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:25,200
The pitch shows were optimised
at a $3500 gold price, which is

858
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:27,880
finally past that.
Yeah, yeah, she's up to 4000

859
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:29,000
now.
Chuck 4 1/2 on.

860
00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:30,200
It.
So it might be mineable now,

861
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,480
yeah.
And but that's the thing.

862
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,880
That's what like these a lot of
these historic things at 4000

863
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:37,760
bucks an ounce, like
everything's like right?

864
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:40,840
Where does gold exist because
they've got what they've got

865
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:45,520
881,000 oz at 1 1/2 bit over two
third of the resource resource

866
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:48,400
is underground.
About 3/4 of the resource is

867
00:45:48,400 --> 00:45:51,480
inferred too.
But look, it's very it's very

868
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:54,160
low grade for an underground.
But it as I said, it does look

869
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:55,720
like it's got a bit of thickness
to it.

870
00:45:55,720 --> 00:45:59,200
So you know, I've got 1.6 gramme
underground.

871
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:02,760
Might bloody get a look in these
days over 4000 bucks an ounce.

872
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:06,360
But I would assume this when
they're talking JV arrangement,

873
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:10,280
I would think it would be for
the satellite pits which you can

874
00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:12,960
see in the resource table,
there's a lot of them.

875
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:16,520
There's, there's 11 resources
they've got in that sandstone

876
00:46:16,520 --> 00:46:22,400
project for 307,000 oz, which
are two third 2/3 indicated.

877
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:27,520
So there's that old half a
million tonne per annum mil that

878
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:31,240
needs a bloody good reefer or
knocked down and completely

879
00:46:31,240 --> 00:46:32,800
replaced.
I think from what I saw, that

880
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:34,920
last operated in 2010.
Troy.

881
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,600
Resources, so she's she'd be a
bit of a rust bucket by now, but

882
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:44,160
it is it is permitted yeah to
produce half A to for 1/2 a

883
00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:47,840
million tonne throughput does
have associated infrastructure,

884
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:50,480
but I'd imagine there'd be a lot
of work to get that making gold

885
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,120
again.
So anyway, probably just might

886
00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:56,600
be a there's 11 pits MMS can RIP
the RC out of.

887
00:46:57,000 --> 00:46:58,360
Yeah, probably a good job for
them.

888
00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,480
Yeah.
Well, that acquire, if they're

889
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:05,440
on an ML for example, like that
kind of unlocks the like a

890
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:10,160
processing location in some ways
for, yeah, for, for Bryce's

891
00:47:10,240 --> 00:47:13,320
other regional stuff.
But you're not like for what

892
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:16,160
there there are other regional
stuff you you wouldn't be.

893
00:47:16,720 --> 00:47:17,680
Well, we're they're going to
have.

894
00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:19,120
To they're going to build,
they're going to either.

895
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:20,280
Where's that blank?
Got to go.

896
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:24,040
They either got a bloody buy
Kirk a locker or build a

897
00:47:24,240 --> 00:47:28,480
2,000,000 tonne mill at
Sandstone to feed the Alto stuff

898
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:30,920
into.
So this one doesn't really,

899
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:36,320
yeah, might be might be just a a
shorter term option for a bit of

900
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:37,960
cash flow to start ripping pits
out.

901
00:47:37,960 --> 00:47:42,800
But when we say shorter term
takes a while to get those

902
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,240
things approved.
So anyway, we'll wait and see.

903
00:47:46,120 --> 00:47:49,080
I think to the point on the gold
price running and then all these

904
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:52,760
deposits just becoming sort of
in the money if you like only

905
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,480
works for a period of time like
we've we've talked in the.

906
00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:57,640
Past about that.
Yeah.

907
00:47:57,640 --> 00:48:00,680
I mean, we, well we talked in
the past about how gold costs,

908
00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:05,080
mining costs just track it.
So sooner or later, you know,

909
00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:08,480
I'm at least of the view that
gold mining prices will, will

910
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:12,600
get there like the, the margins
don't just blow out and stay out

911
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:16,160
indefinitely on gold like they
haven't historically.

912
00:48:16,160 --> 00:48:17,720
Maybe they will for quite a
while.

913
00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:20,960
But I think we put a chart in
the, in the director special

914
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:25,720
just last week and you can see
over, you know, decades that the

915
00:48:25,720 --> 00:48:28,560
costs track the gold price that
they have.

916
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:32,000
And I think we're in a period of
time where gold miners can make

917
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:34,720
a good bit of money because the
price has sparked a lot more

918
00:48:34,720 --> 00:48:38,000
than what the costs have.
But I don't think that sort of

919
00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:43,640
tends to to last forever.
The only rebuttal to that would

920
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:46,920
be is if I think it'd be
different when all commodities

921
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:49,280
are lifting.
We've seen lithium, nickel and

922
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,000
all that fall off the Cliff and
you're thinking what's your main

923
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:56,480
cost is the mining of it.
So if other commodities are

924
00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:59,240
stressed, that one's up and
you're still trying to get

925
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:03,600
doesn't an underground mine
isn't contractually priced on

926
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:05,840
what the commodity price is.
It's just.

927
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:07,880
Yeah.
And gold price is international

928
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:11,040
and the the costs are much more
local.

929
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:13,160
So it's it's not the same
everywhere.

930
00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:15,680
And just remember, the cure for
high prices is high prices

931
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:18,360
because there's margin and all
these marginal things.

932
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:20,920
Now, well, guess what?
People are mining all of these

933
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:23,320
little satellite pits, which
creates a lot more sort of

934
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:25,120
selling pressure for physical
gold.

935
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:26,680
Yeah.
Will the market absorb all that?

936
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:29,280
Or, you know, does it just sort
of like, yeah.

937
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:31,960
I think I think on this size of
scarlet, do you think ape a

938
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:34,040
little satellite jobs in
Australia are going to affect

939
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:37,520
the international gold price A.
100% this is, this is what

940
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:39,920
happens.
This is, this is like there is

941
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,400
no period in history where you
have the 4th quartile of the

942
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:46,240
cost curve making margin for 12
months, 24 months.

943
00:49:46,240 --> 00:49:48,440
It just doesn't work that way.
You incentivize new production

944
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,760
to come online higher on the
cost curve and that new supply,

945
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:54,800
you know meets, meets the
incremental demand at some point

946
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:56,600
and then you get price balance
again.

947
00:49:57,480 --> 00:50:00,440
I think that people are out
there that would fight you on

948
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:04,520
the the supply demand dynamics
of of gold pricing and how it's.

949
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:07,520
Sort of started some.
Different type of asset and

950
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:10,320
these sorts of things, yeah, not
going to be the one that that

951
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:11,520
gets into that.
It's a bit of I'm not.

952
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:14,000
Saying, I'm not saying the
marginal ones in WA alone, I'm

953
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:15,280
saying the marginal ones
globally.

954
00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:17,440
And I'm saying the, the, the,
the gold producers who have a

955
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,320
bunch of, you know, marginal
pits, all of a sudden they just

956
00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:21,560
start feeding that through the
mill as well.

957
00:50:21,560 --> 00:50:24,880
Like there's extra cash at
elevated prices, Yeah.

958
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:27,360
You see it in every commodity.
Like again, like we spoke about

959
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:29,800
last week, that sort of
difference in people stealing

960
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:34,160
copper when it jumps from 9:00
to 12:00, you know, US $1000 a

961
00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:36,360
tonne.
That's the, in a sense a

962
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:38,000
different type of marginal
supply.

963
00:50:38,720 --> 00:50:40,000
I think it's a, it's a real
thing.

964
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:42,280
People realise the opportunity.
Well, the only probably

965
00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:45,840
guarantee I can give is that
it's an Australian earthworks

966
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:49,760
and allege site clearing jobby
coming up out here like that's

967
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:53,320
like we can argue on supply and
demand all you want, but that is

968
00:50:53,560 --> 00:50:57,200
as certain as death and tax that
Reece is going to go bloody

969
00:50:57,560 --> 00:51:00,240
mate.
He he can turn an absolute ship

970
00:51:00,240 --> 00:51:03,560
bucket in of a side into looking
like the F3 from Newcastle to

971
00:51:03,560 --> 00:51:05,640
Sydney like.
Interesting.

972
00:51:05,720 --> 00:51:07,480
Mate, have a look at him out
here.

973
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:10,960
Reese Pitalni on the bloody
dozer, outright enjoying the

974
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:15,320
sunshine of the salt lakes.
Mate he's oh look at that for a

975
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:17,800
highway.
That is, that is, that looks

976
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:20,920
impeccable.
He makes the he may even makes

977
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:25,480
the salt rust proof like that's
how bloody good he is so sight

978
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:26,880
clear he's.
Got to get him on site.

979
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:31,680
Mate it just get bloody aeh to
come and sex up your joint and

980
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:36,680
just make it look like the Rolls
Royce of desert race is the man.

981
00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:38,440
Clearly, Yeah, he'll go move
anything on it, man.

982
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:42,240
Oh mate, it'll be go from the
sandstone to the sexy stone

983
00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:44,320
after Race does his bloody work
on it.

984
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:46,880
So mate, good work Race.
Thanks for making.

985
00:51:47,360 --> 00:51:50,280
Thanks for just making the world
a better place.

986
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:54,920
Good on you JD.
Speaking of, is this company in

987
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:56,320
a better place now?
IGI.

988
00:51:58,880 --> 00:52:00,680
Interesting.
It's an interesting one mate.

989
00:52:00,680 --> 00:52:05,040
The, the quarterly had pros and
cons and I'll I'll run through

990
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:07,880
it kind of quickly.
I think that the three kind of

991
00:52:07,880 --> 00:52:11,720
stand out points are that green
bushes performed better

992
00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:14,600
operationally sort of not
notwithstanding the lithium

993
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:17,160
price.
Nova didn't do so well.

994
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:20,600
It's been a good few quarters
now where it hasn't really

995
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:23,200
performed.
And the the third thing that

996
00:52:23,200 --> 00:52:26,560
stood out was that the company
has stopped disclosing a, a bit

997
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:29,880
of info.
So no more underlying EBITDA at

998
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:33,760
a site level, no more sort of
COGS on, on green bushes.

999
00:52:34,120 --> 00:52:38,200
And that lack of disclosure
obviously naturally became a, a

1000
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:41,440
real sort of talking point of
the quarterly call they put on

1001
00:52:41,440 --> 00:52:44,600
today.
So on a in a bit more detail,

1002
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:47,680
TLA didn't pay a dividend.
Of course, that's the the joint

1003
00:52:47,680 --> 00:52:50,600
venture through which they are
in their Greenbushes stake due

1004
00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:54,040
to weak lithium conditions.
Not a massive surprise, although

1005
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:59,200
Greenbush, Greenbushes unit
costs dropped from about 340

1006
00:52:59,200 --> 00:53:02,920
Aussie per tonne to about 280.
So that was great to see.

1007
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:06,200
Although Kwinana prepared for a
shutdown through the quarter

1008
00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:09,480
that should be complete by the
end of this month and we should

1009
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:11,880
see already performance
improvements in the next

1010
00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:15,480
quarterly report.
There was a few sort of question

1011
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:19,240
marks around how much cash sits
in the joint venture and what

1012
00:53:19,240 --> 00:53:22,240
that's kind of being used for
and questions about why there

1013
00:53:22,240 --> 00:53:27,240
wasn't a a sweep with cash paid
out to the the holders or the

1014
00:53:27,240 --> 00:53:31,520
owners of TLEA Quinana needed
investment.

1015
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:34,600
That was one of the reasons
clearly they sort of said that

1016
00:53:34,600 --> 00:53:38,240
20 million were spent in
sustaining and improvement Capec

1017
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:39,920
there.
But yeah, I think a lot of

1018
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:43,000
people will be scrutinising it
was sort of slightly better

1019
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:45,520
quarter on quarter the tonnes
that came out of the hydroxide

1020
00:53:45,520 --> 00:53:47,480
plant there.
But you know, we're talking from

1021
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:52,320
a very, very low base on Nova.
There was lower mind volumes and

1022
00:53:52,320 --> 00:53:55,360
lower grade that meant it just
didn't really perform.

1023
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:58,520
Unit costs were as high as
they've been in quite some time.

1024
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:02,320
Forestania is now on on care
maintenance too.

1025
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:06,560
And yeah, just to kind of round
out on the the lack of earnings

1026
00:54:06,560 --> 00:54:09,480
details, they had kind of pre
flagged this and and spoke about

1027
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:13,520
it, but it just makes the the
jobs for the analyst quite a bit

1028
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:15,520
harder.
And a lot of the numbers you can

1029
00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:18,520
still kind of get 2, They kind
of give you enough.

1030
00:54:18,520 --> 00:54:21,480
It just creates a bit more work.
So it's kind of frustrating.

1031
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:24,480
The, I mean, the one thing they
probably should do is is Chuck

1032
00:54:24,480 --> 00:54:26,920
in a, a waterfall chart.
I don't know too many other

1033
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:29,840
companies that don't at least
put in a waterfall chart.

1034
00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:33,040
And it was interesting to see
the company's rationale for, for

1035
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:37,000
not giving this disclosure was
that it sort of simplifies their

1036
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:40,600
business and reduced cost.
So I'm, I'm not personally sure

1037
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:43,840
how much effort and money goes
into just being able to give a

1038
00:54:43,840 --> 00:54:45,840
few more details in your
quarterly, but maybe it's more

1039
00:54:45,840 --> 00:54:48,760
than I'm kind of anticipating
and maybe I should give them the

1040
00:54:49,040 --> 00:54:52,720
the benefit of the doubt there.
But that was a a defence to

1041
00:54:52,720 --> 00:54:56,040
that, that I wasn't expected.
Just to finish up on where they

1042
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:59,120
are now, the balance sheet sort
of perspective, net cash is

1043
00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:03,120
sitting at about $260 million.
This dropped off over $200

1044
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:05,720
million because of course they
paid about $200 million in

1045
00:55:05,720 --> 00:55:08,360
dividends.
That was the FY24 DV that they

1046
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:10,840
distributed.
That was a pretty big miss

1047
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:14,240
though, because consensus was
sitting around $340 million.

1048
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:16,920
So they came in a a good bit
below that.

1049
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:20,120
And to kind of cap things off,
the company warned that should

1050
00:55:20,120 --> 00:55:22,800
the conditions in the lithium
market persist, there'd be a

1051
00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,080
drain on cash.
So nothing new there.

1052
00:55:25,080 --> 00:55:28,880
It was just a bit of an ominous
kind of sign to to leave the

1053
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:32,160
report on shares ended up pretty
flat.

1054
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:35,480
I think the the good side of
green bushes and operating

1055
00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:38,440
better outweighed some of the
negatives in the company.

1056
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:42,640
But yeah, just a bit of a recap
on what's going on at IGO there.

1057
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:47,080
You bloody go, you know now that
Forest Stone is on care and

1058
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:49,880
maintenance.
Got me eyes peeled when

1059
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:53,440
Medallion will do finalise the
bloody deal to get hold of the

1060
00:55:53,440 --> 00:55:56,120
processing infrastructure there
because I think that was waiting

1061
00:55:56,480 --> 00:56:02,040
on them to finish final bit of
processing on that site.

1062
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:03,840
So if it's on care and
maintenance.

1063
00:56:03,840 --> 00:56:06,320
Additional on on raising the
money required to do it too.

1064
00:56:06,440 --> 00:56:08,200
Yeah, yeah.
So they've had a bit of it.

1065
00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:11,320
They're really bloody.
They've doubled since they first

1066
00:56:11,320 --> 00:56:13,160
announced that.
So got my eyes on that.

1067
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:16,520
Be good to see another bloody
gold copper project going in

1068
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:18,920
just WA.
Good morning.

1069
00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:21,560
And seeing the seeing the meal
just on care and maintenance,

1070
00:56:21,560 --> 00:56:23,240
get it in, get it in use for
someone else.

1071
00:56:23,280 --> 00:56:25,960
That's it, Yeah.
Yeah mate, it's bloody eepoo.

1072
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,040
This will all come out tomorrow.
All me flagged predictions

1073
00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:31,080
guaranteed.
You're fucking great.

1074
00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:35,240
I I actually know Maddie.
Who else could help the guys at

1075
00:56:35,240 --> 00:56:36,240
Medallion?
But who?

1076
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:38,360
Might that be Jonas Benedict
darling?

1077
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:42,240
I I might suggest Mineral Mining
services, grounded cross

1078
00:56:42,240 --> 00:56:45,920
boundary energy, Sandvik, CRE
insurance, Greenland's

1079
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:49,520
equipment, K drill, MMTS,
Australian earthworks and

1080
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:53,760
haulage and then they can use a
spark chart and just watch their

1081
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:57,240
stock price go flying after
they've hired the rest of them.

1082
00:56:57,320 --> 00:57:00,120
Oh mate, we've just offered a
turnkey solution.

1083
00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:03,400
Hooteru buddy.
Hooteru, guys, Hooteru.

1084
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:06,560
Cheers Bras.
Information contained in this

1085
00:57:06,560 --> 00:57:09,320
episode of Money of Mine is of
general nature only and does not

1086
00:57:09,320 --> 00:57:11,960
take into account the
objectives, financial situation

1087
00:57:12,000 --> 00:57:14,040
or needs of any particular
person.

1088
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:17,360
Before making any investment
decision, you should consult

1089
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:20,440
with your financial advisor and
consider how appropriate the

1090
00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:24,120
advice is to your objectives,
financial situation and needs.