Jeff Phillips: 2 Details That Make or Break a Mining Bet

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My most controversial view is I
think they should go back for

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the year hold.
I think all the exchanges that

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say, look, if you're going to
get warrant coverage, you at

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least have to be able to hold
the stock for a year.

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And a year is going off that
long period of time, especially

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when you're getting some sort of
warrant coverage.

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Jeff Phillips, he's been
financing and backing resource

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companies for more than 30
years, sat on both sides of the

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table, broker, funder, investor
through every mining cycle.

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No spotting serious teams early,
walking away from bad paper even

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faster.
You've Jeff, you've been behind

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a bunch of a bunch of names that
have gone on to have great

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shareholder success.
Almadex, Riverside, Headwater,

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those are those are the North
American names and, and down

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under.
I'm sure we'll explore some of

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the ones you've been involved in
too.

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But in short, you're a bit of a
seasoned sector insider who

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invests your own money.
You tell it straight and you

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understand how value actually
gets created.

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And the challenging small cap
junior mining end of the

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business.
Jeff, thanks for joining us on

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Money and Mine.
Thank you for having me guys.

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Really appreciate it.
I am thrilled to, to kind of

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peel into your, your brain,
Jeff, on, on some of the things

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that are just part of your, your
investing DNA or, or part of

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your screening process.
And they can't be erased.

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And I'm talking about things
like like alignment management,

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alignment, capital, capital
structure, like, what are these

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things like mean to you?
Because you know, I, I know that

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without them, it doesn't matter
how good the rocks are.

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It's it's just a no.
Yeah.

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Basically I look for two things,
share structure and people.

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When I say share structure, you
said capital align and that's a

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good way of putting it.
I like to see that management

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has what some people call skin
in the game.

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I like to make sure that they
don't have skin in the game, but

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they're fully reporting.
You guys are different in

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Australia because you can see
all the shareholders, but in the

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Canadian markets, you know,
unless you're fully reporting,

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you can do what you want with
your shares.

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So I like to see management
that's got a sizable position

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that's fully reporting.
That means they're reporting to

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Cedar in the Canadian markets or
the equivalent in the US

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markets, their position and
you're going to know if they

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decide to sell stock or, or you
know, and so forth.

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So the other thing I like to see
with shareholder alignment, and

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I think that's a great term, is
I like to know who the other

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shareholders are.
You know, a lot of these, it's

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the same in Australia, although
I'm more focused on the North

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American markets, but obviously
there's crossover.

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I like to see that the other
shareholders are like minded to

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me that they're, they're in the,
you know, investing in a company

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for a period of years, not
months.

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So, you know, the development
and exploration business is very

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difficult.
So here in the Canadian markets,

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you know, it used to be back
when I first came in the

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business in the 90s and, and had
quite a bit of success when you

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did a private place when you had
to hold the stock for a year.

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That's why you got some warrant
coverage.

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When I retired after selling an
oil and gas company off of the

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NASDAQ, I came back in the
business in 2004, 2003, started

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financing companies in 2007.
I was astounded to learn that

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the whole period was down to
four months.

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I don't know what you guys do in
Australia, but but even now, you

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know, there's these life
financings in Canada which are

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no hold and they still get
warrants.

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So you, you get a lot of warrant
collectors.

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I want to make sure that
management is, is, you know, I

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like to use a boat analogy.
I'm getting on a lake to get to

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the other side in a boat.
Now I want to make sure

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management's going to row all
the way to the other side and

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they're not jumping out when I
don't know it.

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And I want to make sure the
other shareholders are also

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pulling the Ords.
You know, I want to know

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everybody's in that boat trying
to get to the other side.

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So that's, that's share
structure.

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And obviously having good people
who have a track record of of

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growing companies, growing
market caps or are the ultimate

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thing selling an asset to
another company is, is what I'm

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looking for.
You you'd be disappointed to

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hear that people can flog their
stock within about a day of

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getting it here in in Australia
once the racing's done.

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But we don't have, we don't
have, we don't have the yeah,

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like the prevalence of like
attaching warrants and warrant

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collectors that.
Nowhere near as as strong as it

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sounds in in North America and
Canada in the resource market,

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yeah.
Well, look there, there may be,

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there's slight differences
obviously, but at the end of the

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day, the resource market is is
not really investing.

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It's educated, speculating and
and again, you know, whenever

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you have things that can go up
and become billion dollar assets

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in any type of market, you get
the people that aren't

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necessarily the long term
shareholders or people trying to

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do what's best for the group.
So.

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Jeff, I'm really curious, like
what Trev said to peel into your

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investing framework and, and in
particular your, your

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psychology, because having done
a bit of digging, the the way

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you sort of frame it is, is, is
simple, but simply an investing

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is often the hardest thing to
do.

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Being patient and hanging in the
name for for two to three years

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at a time.
But you don't seem to, you don't

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seem to have a an awful lot of
trouble sort of doing that.

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You, you, you seem pretty sort
of down, down to earth about all

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of it.
Do you, do you still feel you

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have that internal struggle, you
know, holding on to things,

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being patient, checking the
boxes?

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Or do you think over time you've
just become quite at ease with

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it all?
I think you've become more at

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ease with it over time and you
learn from past mistakes.

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You know, I've been doing this
for a long time and it just

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depends on what you're trying to
do.

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People have different goals.
If my goal was to make the most

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money possible, there's ways to
do that, that I can make a lot

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more money.
Part of my joy.

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And still, again, I'm
essentially retired working full

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time right now, but because it's
because I enjoy it.

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I mean, I, I, I, I enjoy working
with management teams.

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I enjoy the, the hunt.
I enjoy, you know, as long as

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we're looking for something
meaningful, you know, I, I enjoy

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that.
And, and more so than making

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money on a great deal, it's
being part of a team that makes

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money and, and, and having that
connection.

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And some of the people we talked
about earlier, like Michael

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Hudson, you know, we've been
friends now for 15 years and

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we've had some great wins
together.

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And I'm sure we'll have some
more in the future.

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He's a great Australian
geologist.

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But at the end of the day, the
friendship and the camaraderie

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and the, and the past
experiences are what really make

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it fun.
So.

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This is.
Yeah, this is an interesting

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feature of like the part of the
market that you focus on.

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I think Canadians like it's even
more prevalent than maybe

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Australia, but we, we all like
both, both mining centres have,

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yeah, these like kind of
individual high net worth

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financiers who have like a, they
might have like a mining house

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or, or, or a bunch of kind of
relationships with geologists.

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And it's the, the kind of like
tying the geologists with the

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individual with their own
connections that can, that can

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maybe, you know, seed some, some
new project in a, in a, in a

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public vehicle with, with some
kind of story.

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And it's like, wrapped around
it.

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I'm, I'm kind of just like
curious how all of that comes

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together?
Like, how do you, how do you

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actually like identify, like, I
identify a project worthy of,

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worthy of, of investing in the
1st place.

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Be be kind of cultivate a
network of finances alongside

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you who you know are like
motivated to be there for the

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same duration and and see
understand the opportunity.

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Well, over time, you build that
network up, you know, again,

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and, and sometimes people fall
out of your network because

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they're not exactly what you,
you thought they'd be.

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I, I don't you again, I'm not
Canadian.

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I'm, I'm based here in San
Diego, CA, not a mining Mecca of

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the world, although obviously
Rick rules operation was based

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here for a long time.
And but, but, but again, you

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build up that network of people
and you build up teams and

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there's all kinds of, you know,
I liken this to, I think I'm

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used to analogy.
I don't know if you guys have

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fantasy, fantasy sports there,
but all my friends here play

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fantasy football and they're,
they're on teams and they pick

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their teams and they're every
weekend, they spend all weekend

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talking about their teams.
I play football and I enjoy the

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sport, but I don't play fantasy
football cause all week long I

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have fantasy resource stocks in
the market.

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I have friends and teammates.
And you know, again, it's like

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you said, it's a shareholder,
you know, capital alignment and

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you know, but again, there's
lots of good groups, you know,

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even here in North America,
America and Canada that, you

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know, do great jobs and I
respect them, but I don't

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necessarily work with them
because I have my own network.

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If, if I like think more deeply
about the the point on on

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alignment, just just one small
like if you, if you like, if you

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see ACEO that has like AI don't
know like a three $300,000 per

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year salary or $350,000 per year
salary and they own like less

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than 1% of the stock.
And it's like a, you know, 5 to

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$10 million market cap.
What does that tell you?

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Oh it.
Tells me I probably don't want

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to look at the company anymore.
I look at, you know, like deals

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today.
You know, there are some cases

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where it's a young guy that's
been brought in and he doesn't

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have a lot of money and, you
know, so he doesn't have a lot.

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But again, you know, but again,
if you tell me that same

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company, the CEO owns 2%, he's a
younger guy, but they have, you

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know, two other directors at
each own 15% fully reporting.

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And then you tell me that, you
know, they've got several funds

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that own fully reporting and
it's 50% of the stock is owned

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by, is owned by fully reporting
shareholders.

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I know those people are trying
to build something because

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they're not being able to flip
their stock.

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And you know, we're into a
market now, which it makes it

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even harder.
You know, we're, we're in a bull

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market.
So, so again, you know, the

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hardest thing is if you've been
in the business a long time is

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you see the stocks go up and you
have to remind yourself what a

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bull market looks like.
Because again, otherwise it's

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kind of like, well, Gee, are
these things really worth 4

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times what they were 12 months
ago?

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But the fact is in a bull
market, and the last one I saw

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was the 2008 to 2011 bull
market, which really was just a

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continuation of the 2003 to 2007
with the real estate bubble in

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between.
You know, it's pretty amazing in

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a bull market.
So I think this is going to be a

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really big bull market.
And I think, you know, a lot of

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the people that are short term
players, they're going to be

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real happy they're finally
getting bailed out or going to

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get out early.
And I think they're going to

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find this thing has a long way
to go.

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How to to sort of further Trav's
question there, how do you think

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about options, performance
rights and these things?

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Do you kind of comb through them
quite carefully and and make

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sure everything is sort of on
side with how you think about

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alignment?
Yeah, well, mostly options to

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management are fully reporting,
so I can see what that is.

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And you have the problem that,
you know, when those are

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expiring, sometimes they have to
exercise those and sell some for

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tax purposes.
So I do keep an eye on that all

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the time and talk to those
companies.

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I typically have half a dozen
companies.

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I'm a large shareholder and I
have, I own more companies, but

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I mean very large shareholdings
and I also consult for those

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companies.
So yeah, I'm monitoring all

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that.
But again, most of my companies

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00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:56,640
have anywhere from 30 to 50%
fully reporting insider

225
00:10:56,640 --> 00:10:59,040
ownership.
Their main goal is to make those

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00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:01,560
shares worth money and they're
not able to sell those shares

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00:11:01,560 --> 00:11:05,320
unless they transact, which
means they sell the business or

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they get into a wild bull
market.

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00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,480
Again, if I own a stock that's
up $0.50 stock, and this has

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00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:13,720
happened many times over 30
years, and we get into a bull

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00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:17,080
market, it goes to $15.00.
It may not get sold it, you

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00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:20,200
know, again, it's got something
real, but I'm going to take some

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00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,080
profit off the table and anybody
should in that situation.

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00:11:23,680 --> 00:11:26,360
I'm not, I'm probably taking it
off the table at 4:00 and 5:00

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00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,480
and 8:00 and $10.00.
But, but again, I think we're in

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that situation where it gets
very hard.

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If you're been in the business a
long time and you have evaluated

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00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:38,440
lots of companies, I think this
the bull markets always skew,

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00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:42,520
you know, you tend to be too
smart for your own good.

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I had a famous, one of my
mentors, I've had a number of

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00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:48,760
them was Jim Dines.
You wrote the Dines letter for

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00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:50,600
63 years here in the United
States.

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00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:55,040
Very famous gold bug, Internet
bug, first marijuana bug.

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00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:57,760
He had lots of things.
He claimed that he was the first

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00:11:57,760 --> 00:12:00,280
in and he was.
But one of his things was, you

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00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:04,000
know, look, don't think.
And he was referring to charts

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00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,440
that, you know, again, if
something's in a bullish trend,

248
00:12:06,440 --> 00:12:09,240
just because you think it's gone
up a lot, you know, don't think

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00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:13,800
too much in a bull market, you
know, So I think we're heading

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00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:16,440
into a market where, you know, I
have to remember to look and not

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00:12:16,440 --> 00:12:18,520
think because if I think too
much, I'm going to go, Gee, I

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00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:22,560
remember the last 15 years and
and it wasn't this market, so.

253
00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:26,760
Rains can be the enemy of gains
in a bull market, but the.

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00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:28,680
Absolutely.
That's a great way of putting

255
00:12:28,680 --> 00:12:31,400
it.
Yeah, but it's funny because

256
00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:34,240
some of the things that do that
they end up, you know, going all

257
00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:37,080
the way back down again.
And I I'm, I'm certain you've,

258
00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:39,760
you've written a few of those in
your in your tenure.

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00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:40,760
Jeff absolutely.
Yeah.

260
00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:44,840
I, I, I always joke.
I sell, I sell some of it too

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00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:46,560
early.
I sell some of it perfectly and

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00:12:46,560 --> 00:12:49,440
I hold some just because I think
it might go higher and I still

263
00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:52,520
have it lower.
So, you know, again, you, you

264
00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:55,840
never, you know, I mean, the
best deal is the deal that sells

265
00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:57,760
at, at, at a record, which is
very seldom.

266
00:12:57,760 --> 00:13:00,120
But you know, and I've had those
where a deal sold to another

267
00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:02,480
company and it's sold at the
highest price the shares ever

268
00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,800
traded at.
And it doesn't get any better

269
00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:06,240
than that.
I just had a deal that I

270
00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:09,200
financed, I was in the financing
called Horizon Copper and it was

271
00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:14,440
bought out by Royal Royal Gold,
the royalty company and and all

272
00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:16,280
cash offer.
That's kind of a no brainer.

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00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,720
It was bought out at the highest
price it ever traded at and that

274
00:13:19,720 --> 00:13:22,120
was great.
So you, you seem to really

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00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:25,600
analyze the, the people, the
people behind businesses, the

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00:13:25,600 --> 00:13:30,080
people aspect of bull markets.
How does the exuberance where

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00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:32,080
we're feeling right now, which
is sort of flushed on quite

278
00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:38,800
quickly compared to 2007, call
it 2011, 96 ish before BREEX,

279
00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,480
these sorts of things.
You know, I was, I was probably

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00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,600
your guy's age and, and during
breaks I came in the market.

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00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:50,200
I actually indirectly worked for
Rick Roll and we were pretty

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00:13:50,200 --> 00:13:52,760
successful and, but had less
capital.

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00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:56,000
So that was a crazy market from,
I mean, I started investing in

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00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:57,760
the resource stocks right out of
college.

285
00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:00,280
So that must have been 92 or
three or something like that.

286
00:14:00,680 --> 00:14:02,120
I mean, it was a really crazy
market.

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00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:04,720
It's hard for me to remember.
You know, I'll give you an

288
00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:07,200
example that I can remember, you
know, in a bull market.

289
00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:10,080
I had a company in the rare
earth boom, the first boom back

290
00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:12,800
in 2008, and before people knew
what rare earths were, they

291
00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:15,760
weren't even talked about.
I'd financed the company at

292
00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,680
$0.75.
Then the real estate crisis hit

293
00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:22,000
and there were no bidders for
stocks and the resource sector

294
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:25,160
and I was calling another high
net worth individual and we were

295
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:28,640
playing every other day who was
going to buy the stock at $0.26.

296
00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:32,200
The bull market took off and
where it's got, you know, going

297
00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:33,800
and, and all the commodities
were doing good.

298
00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:37,160
No 9:00 and 10:00.
And we ended up financing the

299
00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:39,520
company after we couldn't find
buyers and bought them places

300
00:14:39,520 --> 00:14:42,000
shares.
We did another financing at a

301
00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:43,920
dollar.
A month later we financed it at

302
00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:47,440
$1.50 and a month after that we
financed it at $3.

303
00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:50,120
We never sold any of that stock.
It was a bull market.

304
00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:53,000
The stock eventually went to
$1819 a share.

305
00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:55,760
You know, it was trading its
entire float two years later

306
00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:59,800
every day.
So again, from that, that's a

307
00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,840
bull market from three years
where nobody wants to buy the

308
00:15:02,840 --> 00:15:06,320
stock to three years later.
It's on CNBC here in the States

309
00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:08,400
and they're talking about this
little company that you couldn't

310
00:15:08,400 --> 00:15:10,120
get anyone to buy three years
before.

311
00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:13,320
So we're, we're in early innings
of a bull market.

312
00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:15,560
That doesn't mean there won't be
some hiccups.

313
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:17,880
You know, I think there's going
to be, you know, again, we'll,

314
00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:21,360
we'll get some of the, the, the,
the people that are short term

315
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:24,640
players selling out stocks and
you know, it'll be healthy for

316
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,640
gold to have a sell off and, and
build a new base and then go to

317
00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:29,800
new highs.
So, you know, but I, I think

318
00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:31,920
we're in early innings of a, a
major bull market.

319
00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:36,760
Yeah, it it sounds like you're
pretty, pretty attuned to just

320
00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:41,040
the impact that low float or or
tight float can have just in in

321
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:42,920
share price dynamics.
I think in, you know, in this

322
00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:46,000
bull market, even even my
observations on some of the some

323
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,320
of the stocks that are most
volatile to the upside there,

324
00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:52,440
there's absolutely kind of a a
low float dynamic to what's

325
00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:54,400
going on.
Combine that with with a bit of

326
00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:57,640
retail energy and it doesn't
take much to have just yeah,

327
00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:00,960
very outside smooths.
That comes back to share

328
00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:03,400
structure again too.
And, and that's why it's

329
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,400
important because you want to
have a lower float, you want to

330
00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,160
have people that are committed
longer term, because when you go

331
00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:11,680
to raise money again, remember
most of these companies, whether

332
00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,840
in Australia or Canada, aren't
making any money.

333
00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,280
They, they're spending money
exploring and developing a

334
00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:19,440
project.
So I want to make sure that when

335
00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:22,160
they raise money in the future,
that the capital costs are

336
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:26,400
higher, which is good for me as
a shareholder, less dilution.

337
00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:29,040
And, and a lot has to go.
You know, we can use an example

338
00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:32,560
of an Australian company later
if you want that again, I, I

339
00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:34,920
requested a year hold on the
stock, even though it was only,

340
00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:37,960
or you can do a no hold, but not
even a four month.

341
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:40,160
I said, you know, everybody's
holding their stock, It's locked

342
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,040
up for a year.
It gives the company more room

343
00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:44,920
to run.
It gives the company and the

344
00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:48,760
ability to build out their
assets and raise capital at

345
00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:50,520
higher prices.
So that's why we did that and.

346
00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:55,440
What might that stock be?
Kincora Copper, it's actually

347
00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:59,720
dualist and it's in the, it's on
your exchange there in Australia

348
00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:03,840
and it's in on the TSTSXV in
Canada.

349
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,079
It's a prospect generator which
you guys don't have a lot of in

350
00:17:07,079 --> 00:17:08,920
Australia.
In the United States, we have,

351
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:12,200
you know, more of those.
It's a type of model and and

352
00:17:12,200 --> 00:17:15,400
it's a model that Rick Rule
really pioneered 30 years ago

353
00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:20,680
and it increases your odds of
success and making a discovery

354
00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:26,160
with less dilution.
Dilution is the the enemy of a

355
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:27,920
of a junior trying to make a
discovery.

356
00:17:27,920 --> 00:17:31,760
And it's, it's unavoidable when
you've got yeah, like a, a small

357
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:35,800
market cap and a very capital
intensive, you know, binary kind

358
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,320
of outcome on, on, on continuing
exploration fund.

359
00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:44,280
So the prospect generator model,
you try and farm it out to other

360
00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,200
parties to spend the exploration
and, and you maintain a very,

361
00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,960
very low kind of spend at the
head code itself.

362
00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:59,160
Like why, why is this like this
this like a like more prevalent

363
00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:02,000
in in North America than it is
in Australia from from your

364
00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:05,760
perspective and.
Yeah, I can't answer that

365
00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:08,880
question why you do that, except
that maybe Australians like the

366
00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:10,600
the thrill of the chase even
more.

367
00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:13,200
I mean, you still get that with
a prospect generator.

368
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:15,440
But the difference is instead of
raising money to drill your

369
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:17,920
property, which you know, again
doesn't always go the way you

370
00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:21,040
want it to and can take time,
you're like, it's kind of like

371
00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:23,840
you said, you're joint venturing
your property out, properties

372
00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:26,040
out to other people.
And again, it's all about the

373
00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,080
people running the company.
Just because you're a prospect

374
00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:30,640
generator model doesn't mean
you're executing it properly.

375
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,880
Using Concord as an example
again, you know, two of their

376
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:36,640
projects are, yeah, two of their
projects are joint ventured out

377
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:40,360
to Anglo, a major mining company
that's, you know, spending a lot

378
00:18:40,360 --> 00:18:42,680
of money on these that you would
be a lot of dilution.

379
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:45,760
But at the end of the day,
they're giving up a big piece of

380
00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,320
the property if there's a
discovery to that joint venture

381
00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,840
partner.
But being that Concord is

382
00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:55,560
looking for buried copper, gold
porcheries, which can take time,

383
00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:58,760
it's great to have someone like
Anglo with deep pockets who as a

384
00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:01,480
potential spender and into those
projects of, you know,

385
00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:03,840
$90,000,000 or something like
that.

386
00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:06,480
And they have several other
projects joint ventured out with

387
00:19:06,480 --> 00:19:08,120
other companies.
So next year they're going to

388
00:19:08,120 --> 00:19:11,880
see, you know, 345 properties
drilled that aren't going to

389
00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,480
dilute me as a shareholder.
And what's great about Kincora

390
00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,520
is that it's also very unique
for an Australian listed

391
00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:20,520
company.
It's only got about 42,000,000

392
00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:24,360
shares outstanding.
We cleaned up the structure, you

393
00:19:24,360 --> 00:19:27,520
know 30% of that's owned by
reporting insiders, people on

394
00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:30,520
the board or management.
And then like I said, Rick and I

395
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,920
and a number of other North
American investors that that

396
00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:37,560
have experience in this space,
you know provided a four, $4

397
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:41,560
million of capital to them to
and we put a year hold on our

398
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:43,320
stock.
So you have a float that's, you

399
00:19:43,320 --> 00:19:46,600
know, very tight, you have
management and board that's

400
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:50,400
aligned with a long term goal
and you have a lot of drilling

401
00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,520
getting done next year that you
know, again, there's no

402
00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:53,960
guarantee you're going to find
something.

403
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:57,440
But again, in Concordance case,
their technical teams, bar none.

404
00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:00,400
I mean, you're talking about
guys discovered Katie, as you're

405
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:03,400
talking about guys that were
high up at New Crest before they

406
00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,160
were brought by Newmont.
They know your backyard, they're

407
00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:08,120
Australian and they know in the
Macquarie arc.

408
00:20:08,120 --> 00:20:11,920
So again, it's a great
speculation, but I'm not making

409
00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,560
stock recommendations.
I don't have a newsletter.

410
00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,800
I don't sell anything.
I'm a professional investor and.

411
00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:20,600
You know, I tell everybody in
interviews that, you know, and I

412
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,160
don't know how this pertains to
your Australian markets, but I

413
00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,120
see it here in the North
American markets that, you know,

414
00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:28,920
I try to have a position of, you
know, roughly 12 stocks that I

415
00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:31,280
have a large position in.
And again, I have other ones

416
00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:35,000
because I know people and I do
do financings, but 12 companies

417
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,920
that are my my core holdings and
make up a bulk of my money

418
00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:41,760
that's in that space.
If you have too few companies,

419
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:44,560
you know, again, you run the
risk of there's still Mother

420
00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:46,840
Nature, there's luck, there's
the overall markets.

421
00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:50,560
You know, you're not always in a
bull market, so you want to have

422
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:53,560
enough companies that you have
multiple shots to win.

423
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:56,920
I'm on the other hand, I see so
many investors here that I meet

424
00:20:56,920 --> 00:20:59,920
at conferences that asked me to
look at their portfolio and

425
00:20:59,920 --> 00:21:02,520
there's 90 stocks in their
portfolio that they put it up

426
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,320
for their brokerage firm.
Well, if you have a stock go

427
00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:10,280
from $0.15 to $20, that's great.
But if you have 90 of those

428
00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:12,920
things, it's not going to affect
your portfolio unless you know

429
00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:15,240
again, so, but a bull market
does change that.

430
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:17,520
But I like to follow a model
where you don't have too many

431
00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:20,120
stocks so and, and you lower
your risk.

432
00:21:20,120 --> 00:21:21,760
So I don't know if this is
helping you but.

433
00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:23,680
How?
How do you spread your bets

434
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:27,000
amongst those sort of 12 core
names across commodities?

435
00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:32,080
Well, again, you know, if you're
a, a retailer investor or not a

436
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,520
professional, you want to get
good advice from a broker or a a

437
00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:39,000
third party newsletter writer or
show like yourselves, you want

438
00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:40,800
to, you know, we've got the
Internet now.

439
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,120
My daughter likes to tell me
when I try to remember things

440
00:21:43,120 --> 00:21:44,880
and forget to lick it up on the
Internet.

441
00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:47,520
But you can research a lot of
this stuff.

442
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:50,120
Do your research.
And as far as you know,

443
00:21:50,360 --> 00:21:53,000
everybody you know, again, your
your natural resource.

444
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,720
Polio should be a slice of your
pie.

445
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,920
It's not your whole pie and it's
only, it really is for people

446
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,320
that know what they're doing.
That's why, again, I'm saying

447
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:02,120
you shouldn't listen to me per
SE.

448
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:03,840
Well, you should do your own
research.

449
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,840
But I personally like to have a
basket of companies in different

450
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,600
commodities.
I like to, you know, I say 25%

451
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:12,840
and I probably have because I'm
a professional, I probably have

452
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:15,920
16 companies right now.
And plus I think we're into a

453
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,760
bull market.
But 25% of those are prospect

454
00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:22,200
generators, which are again, are
farming out their projects.

455
00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:24,480
And just because something's a
prospect generator doesn't make

456
00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:26,800
it a good deal.
It's how you format your

457
00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:28,120
projects.
Who are your partners?

458
00:22:28,120 --> 00:22:29,760
What is the spend on those
projects?

459
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:32,920
So there's, you know, out of
probably 50-60 prospect

460
00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,400
generators, I know there's six
or seven of them that I think

461
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:38,640
you're making meaningful deals
that that increase my odds

462
00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:41,040
because there's more money being
spent on those projects.

463
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,520
I also then I then I have the
drill hole play.

464
00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,600
I still like to be terrified.
Then I'd go out and and drill

465
00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:50,240
something and, and you know, and
usually it's a brownfields type

466
00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:53,040
project I'm looking for again
with a good share structure and

467
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:55,960
good management that has a past
track record of success.

468
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,840
So, you know, again, right now I
have 3 or 4 companies that are

469
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,480
looking for copper, gold.
I've got a uranium company, I've

470
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,760
got a worth company.
I've got, you know, 4-4 or five

471
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:08,360
prospect generators, probably
four.

472
00:23:08,360 --> 00:23:11,440
One of them is not really a
prospect generator, Mark, but

473
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:13,800
that that's My Portfolio.
But just because it's My

474
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:15,960
Portfolio doesn't mean it's the
right portfolio for someone

475
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:17,920
else.
Sometimes when the prospect

476
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,400
generated, when things go right,
they pivot and they become not a

477
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,960
prospect generator anymore.
And yeah, the it's like, you

478
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:25,800
know, it's about the the
discovery that was had.

479
00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:29,280
But when does a prospect?
And I actually, I'm sorry, I

480
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:30,560
didn't mean to catch.
You that's OK.

481
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:32,800
Yeah, I'll, I'll, I'll let you
finish, but I was just going to

482
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:34,480
add when does a prospect
generator go wrong?

483
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,880
To the contrary.
Well, I, I, I typically like

484
00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,880
what I call the hybrid prospect
generator model, which is a

485
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,640
company that's got a number of
projects generated out, that's

486
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,880
got companies spending, but they
do spend some of their own money

487
00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:50,360
exploring their, you know,
improving some of their 100% own

488
00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:52,520
properties.
And if they are lucky enough to

489
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,040
make discovery, then they focus
on that property.

490
00:23:55,360 --> 00:23:56,760
But again, I, I like the
balance.

491
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,040
I, I, I kind of like the hybrid
and Concord is kind of like

492
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,400
that, even though they've got
most of their projects available

493
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,200
for joint venture, they have
their gold project which they're

494
00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:07,240
keeping 100% and they're going
to advance that a little bit

495
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,480
further down the food chain, do
some of their own drilling.

496
00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:12,600
You know, and normally a
prospect generator does the

497
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,320
early work and, you know, brings
the company in to do the

498
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:17,720
drilling.
So in that case, Cancora is a,

499
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:20,200
you know why I have several
companies, Cancora Headwater

500
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,840
gold, that's a prospect
generator here in Nevada.

501
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:25,480
And again, they're joint
ventured out Headwater with

502
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:29,720
Newmont, They've got Oceana gold
on other projects.

503
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:33,840
They've got Sentara as a 9%
shareholder, their producer, but

504
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:35,840
they have several projects that
they're going to advance a

505
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:38,720
little bit further.
So Concor and Headwater are two

506
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,560
companies that are hybrid
prospect generators.

507
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:48,320
Get the best in both worlds.
The the the to kind of like, you

508
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:52,720
know, peel it, peel it back a
little bit when you see when you

509
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:56,080
see like the market retail enter
more liquidity, a lot more

510
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:59,040
volume in the lower end of town.
What are your like?

511
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:02,320
What are your instincts tell you
to kind of lean in or to lean

512
00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:06,520
back, Lean out.
Well, right now I I think the

513
00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,800
time is to finance companies
with good people and good share

514
00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:11,400
structure.
I think this thing's got a lot

515
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:13,800
further to run, although I think
there'll be some pretty good

516
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:16,000
hiccups along the way where
people get scared out.

517
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,440
Again, there's a whole different
mentality of investing in junior

518
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,520
resource stocks.
If you're investing $5000 to

519
00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:27,240
make $10,000 and that's your
goal, again, you can do that and

520
00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,960
you don't have to follow
necessarily shear structure.

521
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,840
It's when you have bigger
positions that you're not going

522
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:35,880
to be able to trade and stuff.
So in this market, I think, you

523
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,240
know, it's a speculative market.
I think things are going to keep

524
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:41,200
going higher.
You know, some of the stuff I

525
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,160
would never want to own 9% of
the company like I do in some of

526
00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,360
my companies.
You know, doesn't mean they're

527
00:25:47,360 --> 00:25:50,200
not going to go up five fold
than someone buying $10,000

528
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:51,520
worth.
It just depends on what your

529
00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:54,000
goal is, and I guess you have to
figure that out for yourself.

530
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:58,920
Well, you often, you know,
almost always encourage a a

531
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,080
transaction, a corporate
outcome.

532
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:04,360
Is that the easiest way for for
you to get at or do you sort of

533
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:07,000
see plenty of the time you you
managed to sell down as the

534
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:10,440
company just grows into itself?
Well, on a bull market you

535
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:12,760
managed to sell down or you
know, there's been bull market.

536
00:26:12,760 --> 00:26:15,280
I mean, I say there hasn't been
a bull market for 15 years, but

537
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,200
obviously there was a lithium
bull market.

538
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,040
There's been different bull
markets in that time.

539
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:22,640
And commodities, the lithium
stocks did really, really well

540
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:25,400
from, you know, I don't know, up
until two years ago.

541
00:26:25,400 --> 00:26:29,960
So four years ago, I guess 4 1/2
years ago, you know, the lithium

542
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:31,880
stocks boomed.
And like we talked about, I

543
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,800
financed a company called
Patriot Battery Metals at $0.16.

544
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,080
Later some Australian guys that,
you know, came in and financed

545
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,360
it up $0.40.
And, and I was also involved in

546
00:26:41,360 --> 00:26:43,960
that financing.
But that stock eventually went

547
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,680
to $16.00 on a major discovery
with a management team that's

548
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:51,880
built a lithium company before.
And I took profits along the way

549
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,080
because again at $0.16, you
know, I think I sold stock at

550
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,320
$2.00 all the way up.
But, you know, again, but I was

551
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,760
still selling stock at, you
know, 12 and 14.

552
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,280
So yeah, it wasn't a
transaction.

553
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:05,040
It's still, it's a tremendous
asset.

554
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:08,360
Lithium prices came back 90%.
So the stock came all the way

555
00:27:08,360 --> 00:27:10,720
back to 250.
Now it's starting to move back

556
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,120
up with the lithium prices.
And if lithium continues to

557
00:27:13,120 --> 00:27:15,840
improve, it'll probably be a
$16.00 stock again.

558
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,000
But, but again, yeah, it's not
always a transaction.

559
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,280
And but I'd like to see a
transaction because the other

560
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:26,200
thing I don't like is when guys
are good developers or good

561
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:29,200
exploration geologists try to
put something into production

562
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:33,040
and become mine guys.
The transition obviously doesn't

563
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,440
always work.
So you, you really play by

564
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,760
these, these kind of rules.
Jeff, I'm, I'm curious to hear

565
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,040
if you, if you look back in your
career, when did you sort of

566
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:46,040
land on this kind of model
coming out the 90s into that

567
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,480
bull run into to the 2000s?
Have you been, you know, playing

568
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,240
by the same sort of script since
then?

569
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,320
Or how did it all come about?
Well, I think it comes about

570
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,000
over learning over time.
I've always tried to, you know,

571
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:02,440
but you can say this, but I, you
guys don't know me, but here in

572
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,600
the North American market,
especially in Canada, I have a,

573
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:07,520
you know, pretty good reputation
of following through on what I

574
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:09,640
say I'm going to do, being a
good team player.

575
00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:12,280
And, and again, that's what's
important to me.

576
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,680
It's not who makes the most
money in the business, it's

577
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:18,360
having a good reputation and
also making money along the way.

578
00:28:18,360 --> 00:28:19,880
Obviously that's part of the
fun.

579
00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:22,840
But so I've learned from
experience, you know, when I

580
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:25,760
first came in the market, I was
26 years old and it was a bull

581
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:27,800
market.
It was 1994 or something like

582
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:29,960
that.
And I thought I found, you know,

583
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:31,280
I didn't know why I went to
college.

584
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:33,000
I thought, hey, I don't need to
go to college.

585
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:34,840
Everything I buy double S in
three weeks.

586
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:36,880
I thought I found a broken slot
machine.

587
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:38,520
I didn't realize I was in a bull
market.

588
00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:42,320
So I, you know, I learned and I
got lucky that, you know, my

589
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:45,440
partner and I ended up starting
an oil and gas company with AI.

590
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,120
Don't know, a $20 million market
cap When we took it public and

591
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:52,240
we sold it 99 for 480 million.
There was a lot of luck involved

592
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,480
in that too.
So I but again, I I thought it

593
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:58,480
was a broken slot machine.
I didn't know that the resource

594
00:28:58,480 --> 00:28:59,960
market didn't always act that
way.

595
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:03,000
So what, what, what, what?
Was the sort of play there, was

596
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:05,600
it just sort of picking up a
bunch of land and then the the

597
00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:07,720
cycle kind of changed?
Or how did it sort of play out

598
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,200
in your favor?
The play in my oil and gas

599
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:12,720
company or the play in the the
reversible market?

600
00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:16,000
The oil and gas play well.
Well, that was funny that, you

601
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:18,480
know, we, we were working with a
company that was actually one of

602
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:22,520
the most successful companies
listed in, in over time, I think

603
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:27,200
the stock went from originally
$0.75 to $10 back to $0.75

604
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:29,320
because of all the, you know, I
learned that, that a lot of the

605
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:31,600
people that are big
shareholders, even when the

606
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:35,240
assets were incredible, they
sold their stock and, and tried

607
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:38,560
to joint venture assets out to
their own benefit to their other

608
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:40,800
companies.
But eventually that company went

609
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,520
back from 10 to $0.75.
The new management came in

610
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,440
because the assets were
uncountable and went to $200 a

611
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:48,000
share.
And because of that company,

612
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:52,080
over a 10 year period, because
of that company, we got wind of

613
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:53,840
another oil and gas plant in
Wyoming.

614
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:56,640
And we were young.
I mean, we were 2829 years old.

615
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,120
And we ended up staking as much
ground on that hiring land.

616
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,480
And you know, it's a bad episode
of a cable, you know, which

617
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,440
staked everything because we
realized these two NASDAQ

618
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,360
companies were and we leveraged
ourselves to the tilt.

619
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:12,120
You know, we had so much land.
We didn't, you know, you know,

620
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:13,800
and luckily we brought
management in it.

621
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,760
I mean, the board was a bunch of
friends and that, you know,

622
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,160
again, we learned through
experience, but we brought

623
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:22,920
management and it would actually
run a, a, a NASDAQ public

624
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,200
company and retired.
But he'd looked at what we had

625
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:27,200
and said, this is pretty
incredible.

626
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:30,360
And it was really those guys
that 2 1/2 years later were able

627
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:33,320
to sell the company through
development for, for, you know,

628
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:36,880
$18.00 a share or something.
So again, it wasn't total skill,

629
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:39,160
it was a learning experience at
29 years old.

630
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:41,600
And at that time I thought, wow,
I'm going to retire.

631
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:45,560
We were the largest shareholders
of the company, but again you

632
00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:49,640
get bit by the bug and here I am
but 30 years later still doing

633
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:50,760
this.
That's awesome.

634
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:55,240
Jeff, last question for you.
What's your your your most your

635
00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:00,000
most controversial view in the
resource speculating sector?

636
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:05,760
My most controversial view?
I have a lot of controversial

637
00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,480
views.
You want me to rank my most

638
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:11,400
controversial?
You can just give me one.

639
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:14,600
I don't know the people's names
would be involved in that, you

640
00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:19,400
know, you know, you know, my
most controversial view is if

641
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,560
you're really trying to develop
an, a, a, a junior resource

642
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:25,160
company that you know, and, and
you really are that's, you know,

643
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,160
if you're not just playing the,
and really this, this hasn't

644
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,000
changed since the gold rush.
And I don't know your Australian

645
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,920
history, but the gold rush here
in California that built San

646
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,560
Francisco.
I mean, you know, Mark Twain has

647
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,360
the famous quote, you know, gold
mines, a hole in the ground with

648
00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,040
a liar standing over it.
What a lot of people don't tell

649
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:45,000
you is Mark Twain actually sold
mining claims before he came up

650
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,760
with that quote and and ended up
writing for the newspaper.

651
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,840
But yeah, I mean, the bottom
line is the Wild West, this

652
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:54,520
stuff.
So if I my most controversial

653
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:57,480
view is I think they should go
back to the year hold, I think

654
00:31:57,480 --> 00:31:59,800
all the exchanges and say, look,
if you're going to get warrant

655
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,800
coverage, you at least have to
be able to hold the stock for a

656
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:04,920
year.
I mean, it would take the entire

657
00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:07,840
Mickey Mouse speculation out of
it and you'd actually have

658
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:09,840
people having to make smart
decisions.

659
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,240
And the year is really not that
long a period of time,

660
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,400
especially when you're getting
some sort of warrant coverage.

661
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:16,760
So that would be very
controversial because most

662
00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,520
people in the Canadian markets
or the Australian markets don't

663
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,960
want to be locked up so.
I love it.

664
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,800
That's that's one I think we are
very well aligned on.

665
00:32:26,800 --> 00:32:29,320
Jeff, really appreciate you
coming on the show sharing how

666
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:32,960
you think about the markets, how
you think about investing in the

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00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:36,280
junior space.
And yeah, thank you for for

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00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:39,640
sharing that with our audience.
Well, I hope this is somewhat

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00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:41,560
helpful.
And again, just to reiterate,

670
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,080
I'm not giving investment
advice.

671
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:45,200
Any companies I mentioned or
companies that have a large

672
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,360
shareholder in and I probably
consult for you should do your

673
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:51,440
own due diligence.
Look at stuff and and really

674
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:55,000
soak as much information as you
can from shows like yourselves

675
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:58,520
and realize that you know you're
you're at you're investing, is

676
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:00,720
investing in, in, in earnings
and dividends.

677
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,800
This is educated speculation, so
make sure you educate yourself.

678
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:07,640
Beautiful.
Thanks so much, Jeff.

679
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,000
Love the way he thinks about
markets, about the world almost

680
00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:14,560
as much as I love our partners.
Mate, a big thank you to focus

681
00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:17,600
the platform by market tech
Sandvik ground support.

682
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:21,280
I mark the conference is coming
up very soon, next week

683
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:23,560
actually, we're going to be in
Sydney, so check that one out.

684
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:25,680
And last but not least,
Intralinks.

685
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:28,320
Who to root?
Who to root?

686
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:32,240
Now remember, I'm an idiot.
JD is an idiot.

687
00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:34,640
If you thought any of this was
anything other than

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00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,360
entertainment, you're an idiot
and you need to read out a

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00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:37,840
disclaimer.